The Black Hand, a Mexican Mafia book - 2008

[MCD]

I been reading this book for a couple weeks its one of the most interesting books I've read. I like how different stories and people pop into the book like peewee aguirre and Character and the crew that shot up that family. I think anyone looking to learn more about La eme and the prison system needs to pick up this book.

[19DAGO04]

One thing that bugs me about this book...and its fuckin nit picky...but...

Del Sol is not a Chula Vista gang. VDS is on the outskirts of CV in South San Diego.

But Bat did grow up in Chula Vista 's Castle Park neighborhood. How the hell did Bat end up riding with Del Sol instead of Otay if he was from the Castle Park hood? Now that's a trip!

[nmarie17]

I've read in articles and posts that Boxer is now a guest speaker in classes..does anyone know where he is being held (prison) ? I'd love a chance to sit in or at least write to him. I've read the book and the near the end where he describes the first time he cried really affected me. I enjoyed the reading very much and am now "obsessed" with learning more.

[youngspade]

I've read in articles and posts that Boxer is now a guest speaker in classes..does anyone know where he is being held (prison) ? I'd love a chance to sit in or at least write to him. I've read the book and the near the end where he describes the first time he cried really affected me. I enjoyed the reading very much and am now "obsessed" with learning more.

Either Homosexual Or A Dumb Cop, But hes already locked up and told all, so hes gay, yup! Im sure he would be happy to sit next to you too!

[MCD]

I've read in articles and posts that Boxer is now a guest speaker in classes..does anyone know where he is being held (prison) ? I'd love a chance to sit in or at least write to him. I've read the book and the near the end where he describes the first time he cried really affected me. I enjoyed the reading very much and am now "obsessed" with learning more.

Either Homosexual Or A Dumb Cop, But hes already locked up and told all, so hes gay, yup! Im sure he would be happy to sit next to you too!

haha

[StillNoScript]

This book's garbage. Some law enforcement and journalists have been trying to make EME look like an east coast Italian mafia for years. I'll tell you right now, if they were, you wouldn't see gang banging the way you see it in LA.

[MCD]

This book's garbage. Some law enforcement and journalists have been trying to make EME look like an east coast Italian mafia for years. I'll tell you right now, if they were, you wouldn't see gang banging the way you see it in LA.

they're not like the italian mob its a whole different breed. a group of mobsters that control thousands of street soldiers, the only thing preventing them from being the most powerful organization is lack of discipline and order

[stickupkidakaBIGBANDIT]

DEL SOL WAS A CLICK OF OTAY. FROM RIVERBOTTOMS TO BEYER. I KNOW HIS FAMILY REAL WELL. HIS SONS ARE FROM OTAY. HIS BEST FRIEND IS FROM OTAY. THERE'S A RUMOR HE HAD AN OTAY TATT.



OTAY IS OLDER.

One thing that bugs me about this book...and its fuckin nit picky...but...

Del Sol is not a Chula Vista gang. VDS is on the outskirts of CV in South San Diego.

But Bat did grow up in Chula Vista 's Castle Park neighborhood. How the hell did Bat end up riding with Del Sol instead of Otay if he was from the Castle Park hood? Now that's a trip!

[StillNoScript]

This book's garbage. Some law enforcement and journalists have been trying to make EME look like an east coast Italian mafia for years. I'll tell you right now, if they were, you wouldn't see gang banging the way you see it in LA.

they're not like the italian mob its a whole different breed. a group of mobsters that control thousands of street soldiers, the only thing preventing them from being the most powerful organization is lack of discipline and order

I don't know if I'd call it control. I think they just extort them. When I hear the word "control", I think of a man walking his dog. "sit dog", the dog sits, etc. If EME is controlling all of these gang members, EME's giving them orders to tag everything, put the number 13 by their tag, which is now common knowledge that it represents their loyalty to EME? EME's ordering all of these random, day to day murders over nothing more than turf? Why? I don't see anything "controlled" about the Chicano gang scene in Los Angeles. Out of control is more like it.

[19DAGO04]

DEL SOL WAS A CLICK OF OTAY. FROM RIVERBOTTOMS TO BEYER. I KNOW HIS FAMILY REAL WELL. HIS SONS ARE FROM OTAY. HIS BEST FRIEND IS FROM OTAY. THERE'S A RUMOR HE HAD AN OTAY TATT.



OTAY IS OLDER.

One thing that bugs me about this book...and its fuckin nit picky...but...

Del Sol is not a Chula Vista gang. VDS is on the outskirts of CV in South San Diego.

But Bat did grow up in Chula Vista 's Castle Park neighborhood. How the hell did Bat end up riding with Del Sol instead of Otay if he was from the Castle Park hood? Now that's a trip!

Crazy! I heard about that too. That DS split off of Otay in the late 1960's. I always thought that was a rumor. I asked a Yato about that. He wouldn't confirm it. But I heard of that split off. I heard that's how -RBLS- started up. Some inner beef in Otay..some spit off to form DS and then RBLS click formed from the rest that stayed with Otay.

My family lived in Otay way back in the day. They said that the gang Otay was around since the 1930's. They beefed with Sidro and Nacional back then. It was before your hood (-OTNC-) popped up. Well, it was pretty much your hood. They were supposed to have gone from just claiming Nacional to OTNC. Is that true? The Nacional->OTNC?

[mayugastank]

This book's garbage. Some law enforcement and journalists have been trying to make EME look like an east coast Italian mafia for years. I'll tell you right now, if they were, you wouldn't see gang banging the way you see it in LA.

they're not like the italian mob its a whole different breed. a group of mobsters that control thousands of street soldiers, the only thing preventing them from being the most powerful organization is lack of discipline and order

I don't know if I'd call it control. I think they just extort them. When I hear the word "control", I think of a man walking his dog. "sit dog", the dog sits, etc. If EME is controlling all of these gang members, EME's giving them orders to tag everything, put the number 13 by their tag, which is now common knowledge that it represents their loyalty to EME? EME's ordering all of these random, day to day murders over nothing more than turf? Why? I don't see anything "controlled" about the Chicano gang scene in Los Angeles. Out of control is more like it.

Yes they have a hard toime controlling anything due to a lack of members --they have their pick of thousands of soldiers and they supposedly got 100 real actual members. Thats why they run into such disarray in controlling anything. They dont have much say in the day to day gangbanging because they are too spread out and lack numbers! During the early part of the 1990s -they were extremely active and had total control of the streets. But those big busts in 1995 and 1999 basically took all of them out. Boxer said that during his time in the 1990s their were only some 20 EME out in the free world . 20 to control thousands of gangs?! No way ....the old heads were saying that their were too many new members being made for the wrong reasons so at their peak of power they pulled the plug on any new member . They went close to 7 years during the 1990s that not a one new member was inducted. When they finally did get numbers ...BANG! a new indictment and a 4th EME snitch....who basically singlehandedly wiped all members on the streets out.They need to make a good deal of new guys to get shit back in order again and I guess their so much resistance in making new members that its virtually impossible to get a full vote, on an incoming street member meaning that if that guy isnt already in Pelican Bay doing time with the main heads he is NEVER going to be considered for membership!What a waste of a power system they have ....people were actually almost killed over being made members during the time they closed their books.
I understand being selective but this is their biggest vaccuum -they can use guys to have a say so --but then other hoods are like he isnt even a real EME....fuck him! which happened in some citys in fountain valley and pomona.....

[MCD]

I don't know if I'd call it control. I think they just extort them. When I hear the word "control", I think of a man walking his dog. "sit dog", the dog sits, etc. If EME is controlling all of these gang members, EME's giving them orders to tag everything, put the number 13 by their tag, which is now common knowledge that it represents their loyalty to EME? EME's ordering all of these random, day to day murders over nothing more than turf? Why? I don't see anything "controlled" about the Chicano gang scene in Los Angeles. Out of control is more like it.

Well the biggest difference between italian mob and eMe n NF is that most of the bosses are locked up and send orders from prison, not like the mob where they operate best outside of prison and are destroyed by incarceration. At least that's how i see it. Also, i heard mob families have an actual screening process before they accept members at the street level, so that cuts out alot of the half-asses and punks. So they got a core of people who are straight business so they work more effectively, and the boss is physically there. Just more communication and order I think. And like mayugastank said there's way too many members for them to control, n you gotta figure most surenos or nortenos don't know all the bosses very well personally.

[19DAGO04]

EME's ordering all of these random, day to day murders over nothing more than turf? Why? I don't see anything "controlled" about the Chicano gang scene in Los Angeles. Out of control is more like it.

The key word isn't turf, but drug sales. They aren't murdering "over nothing more than turf." They are murdering for drug outlets.

I've seen a certain degree of control. Before the edicts in the early 1990's, drive bys, gang related murders, and banging on civilians in parts Dago were rampant. Aftter the edicts, a drive by by a X3 gang became rare to nil. Most of the drive bys are now being done by black and Asian gangs. Now there are more walk ups. Which is the lesser of the two evils since it is more unlikely that a citizen will get hit in crossfire. Varrios also get warned if they bang on civilians too much or if civilians get caught in between. Because that brings injunctions and unwanted heat that could put a dent in activities.

I can't speak too much about Los. But everyone from Dago can tell you banging was on a whole different level in the 1980's and 1990's. SESD was similar to LA's warzones. Varrios would bang on other varrios even if they never had history or beef and varrios would always be banging on civilians. Constant wars all over for no good reason other than to just bang. That all changed because eMeros from SD knew it was bad business. It would be a free for all here if -eMe- wasn't around (necessary evil). Varrios would always be encroaching on turf for drug sales like in the 1980's and 1990's. Nowadays you get varrios that used to beef chillin together sometimes. Now if hoods have no history of beef, they usually just chill off the bat. In fact-nowadays a lot of varrios won't cross out crosstowners for no reason. Back then-varrios with no beef would cross each other out just to do it.

Everyone says Dago is soft now. SD isn't soft, it's just better organized. You get listed here if you do something that gets unwanted attention. You kill a civilian in SD you might have to PC up or take the punishment doled out in the yard depending on the circumstance.

[mayugastank]

EME's ordering all of these random, day to day murders over nothing more than turf? Why? I don't see anything "controlled" about the Chicano gang scene in Los Angeles. Out of control is more like it.

The key word isn't turf, but drug sales. They aren't murdering "over nothing more than turf." They are murdering for drug outlets.

I've seen a certain degree of control. Before the edicts in the early 1990's, drive bys, gang related murders, and banging on civilians in parts Dago were rampant. Aftter the edicts, a drive by by a X3 gang became rare to nil. Most of the drive bys are now being done by black and Asian gangs. Now there are more walk ups. Which is the lesser of the two evils since it is more unlikely that a citizen will get hit in crossfire. Varrios also get warned if they bang on civilians too much or if civilians get caught in between. Because that brings injunctions and unwanted heat that could put a dent in activities.

I can't speak too much about Los. But everyone from Dago can tell you banging was on a whole different level in the 1980's and 1990's. SESD was similar to LA's warzones. Varrios would bang on other varrios even if they never had history or beef and varrios would always be banging on civilians. Constant wars all over for no good reason other than to just bang. That all changed because eMeros from SD knew it was bad business. It would be a free for all here if -eMe- wasn't around (necessary evil). Varrios would always be encroaching on turf for drug sales like in the 1980's and 1990's. Nowadays you get varrios that used to beef chillin together sometimes. Now if hoods have no history of beef, they usually just chill off the bat. In fact-nowadays a lot of varrios won't cross out crosstowners for no reason. Back then-varrios with no beef would cross each other out just to do it.

Everyone says Dago is soft now. SD isn't soft, it's just better organized. You get listed here if you do something that gets unwanted attention. You kill a civilian in SD you might have to PC up or take the punishment doled out in the yard depending on the circumstance.

So they dont bang anymore in SD? the varrios are all good? In ELA alot of beef got quashed and bad blood between some varrios got squished...drive bys are non existant and the only gang banging is occassionally done by the rock MMV and others against the MVs...VNE and teh maravillas go at hard still. Out in Long Beach the shit is chaos...they are murking eachother out here no joke...mexicans blasting mexicans and blacks and asians...These ESLONGOs are nuttz -I dont know dude they are killing people all the time out here-and doing staright henious racial shit -like stabbing old black men and killing asian kids --they are at war with the whole city --YET they still make the news for wiping rivals out. They went at it with 18 and BP and ICG and R20 ...and were handing all these big ass hoods their hats --last summer these fools killed maybe 10 mofos out here...they are some treacherous fools and I dont think only the compton varrio tortilla flats are the only ones I ever heard who banged that hard-shoot they just got busted for doing like 12 shootings and 3 murders on their rivals....and they just recently let off on some cambodian kids and took them out a few days after they got busted by the FBI for some racial BS....a

[stickupkidakaBIGBANDIT]

IT WASN'T CALLED OTNC. SAME GANG DIFFERENT NAMES. I HEARD BARRIO UNIDOS (THAT'S WHERE UNITED GIRLS DERIVED FROM SOMEHOW) AND THEN PUEBLO VIEJO. BUT IT WAS ALWAYS THE SAME GANG. BECAUSE THE WEST WAS THE ONLY DEVELOPED AREA OPPOSED TO WHERE THE LOCOS AND BLOCK BOYS ARE FROM.

IT'S DOCUMENTED THAT OTNC WHATEVER NAME IT WAS DURING THAT TIME IS THE OLDEST KNOWN GANG IN THE COUNTY. I SEEN THE RESEARCH PAPERS WHEN THEY DID THE SECOND GANG INJUNCTION FROM A PERSON WHO WORKED FOR THE the'S OFFICE.

LOGAN WAS SECOND THEN OTAY THEN SHELLTOWN. ALSO, AN OLDER LADY WHO I USE TO WORK FOR COMES FROM A BIG FAMILY IN LOGAN AND SHE USE TO PARTY AND GO TO THE MOVIES IN THE 50'S LATE 40'S AND SAID OTNC AND LOGAN WOULD FIGHT AT THE MOVIES AND THEN THAT NEW GANG SHELLTOWN WOULD SMASH ON LOGAN WITH OTNC. HAHAHAHA NEW GANG.

DEL SOL WAS A CLICK OF OTAY. FROM RIVERBOTTOMS TO BEYER. I KNOW HIS FAMILY REAL WELL. HIS SONS ARE FROM OTAY. HIS BEST FRIEND IS FROM OTAY. THERE'S A RUMOR HE HAD AN OTAY TATT.



OTAY IS OLDER.

One thing that bugs me about this book...and its fuckin nit picky...but...

Del Sol is not a Chula Vista gang. VDS is on the outskirts of CV in South San Diego.

But Bat did grow up in Chula Vista 's Castle Park neighborhood. How the hell did Bat end up riding with Del Sol instead of Otay if he was from the Castle Park hood? Now that's a trip!

Crazy! I heard about that too. That DS split off of Otay in the late 1960's. I always thought that was a rumor. I asked a Yato about that. He wouldn't confirm it. But I heard of that split off. I heard that's how -RBLS- started up. Some inner beef in Otay..some spit off to form DS and then RBLS click formed from the rest that stayed with Otay.

My family lived in Otay way back in the day. They said that the gang Otay was around since the 1930's. They beefed with Sidro and Nacional back then. It was before your hood (-OTNC-) popped up. Well, it was pretty much your hood. They were supposed to have gone from just claiming Nacional to OTNC. Is that true? The Nacional->OTNC?

[alexalonso]

He is from Artesia,Ca .Artesia 13 gang.

is there a guy on this board from Arta? I wonder if he knew Boxer.

[AztecNinja]

I knew a cat from Winter Gardens who had a verde when he was in the county, at that time Boxer was in the County aswell and that fool from WG got handled with the quickness, he said that all the southsiders were jumping off just because. Not sure if Boxer was calling it or if the torpedos were trying to impress him but his presence alone made things crack more than usual.

[FAVELA9]

anywhere i could read the book online

[MCD]

So they dont bang anymore in SD? the varrios are all good? In ELA alot of beef got quashed and bad blood between some varrios got squished...drive bys are non existant and the only gang banging is occassionally done by the rock MMV and others against the MVs...VNE and teh maravillas go at hard still. Out in Long Beach the shit is chaos...they are murking eachother out here no joke...mexicans blasting mexicans and blacks and asians...These ESLONGOs are nuttz -I dont know dude they are killing people all the time out here-and doing staright henious racial shit -like stabbing old black men and killing asian kids --they are at war with the whole city --YET they still make the news for wiping rivals out. They went at it with 18 and BP and ICG and R20 ...and were handing all these big ass hoods their hats --last summer these fools killed maybe 10 mofos out here...they are some treacherous fools and I dont think only the compton varrio tortilla flats are the only ones I ever heard who banged that hard-shoot they just got busted for doing like 12 shootings and 3 murders on their rivals....and they just recently let off on some cambodian kids and took them out a few days after they got busted by the FBI for some racial BS....a

every time i hear about LB I hear about the longos fuckin up shit. LB was predominantly black right? Has it been turning around?

[mayugastank]

So they dont bang anymore in SD? the varrios are all good? In ELA alot of beef got quashed and bad blood between some varrios got squished...drive bys are non existant and the only gang banging is occassionally done by the rock MMV and others against the MVs...VNE and teh maravillas go at hard still. Out in Long Beach the shit is chaos...they are murking eachother out here no joke...mexicans blasting mexicans and blacks and asians...These ESLONGOs are nuttz -I dont know dude they are killing people all the time out here-and doing staright henious racial shit -like stabbing old black men and killing asian kids --they are at war with the whole city --YET they still make the news for wiping rivals out. They went at it with 18 and BP and ICG and R20 ...and were handing all these big ass hoods their hats --last summer these fools killed maybe 10 mofos out here...they are some treacherous fools and I dont think only the compton varrio tortilla flats are the only ones I ever heard who banged that hard-shoot they just got busted for doing like 12 shootings and 3 murders on their rivals....and they just recently let off on some cambodian kids and took them out a few days after they got busted by the FBI for some racial BS....a

every time i hear about LB I hear about the longos fuckin up shit. LB was predominantly black right? Has it been turning around?

Longos are treacherous-murderous fools. I dont think Ive ever heard of a gang in Los Angelos except maybe Mara Salvatrucha and a few 18 clicks ever killing people like that. But the Longos are known statewide for having some notorious killers. People I knew who were locked up told me about them having outright racist NK and AK tattoos acroos their faces and that whenever you meet a Longo he's in their for a 187 on his enemies black or asian. Recently I posted some stuff on how they let some cops have it after getting off on some asians-they also did 2 dozen shootings and 2 murders along with killing some 4 asians in a span of a few months. They must surely not have many members left as every time I read teh press telegram -theyve just killed someone else. I couldnt imagine growing up like them.

[FAVELA9]

they should make a movie about this dude i think it would be sick as hell , just dont know who would play his role , maybe the hitman from no country for old folks.

[alexalonso]

check out this more recent interview of Rene Boxer Enriquez



Does not look like he is serving a life sentence