N0R~CAL STREET GANGS

[~J~]

We can't dog the fellow too bad considering it'd been nice to have a map like his to look at some years back even if it's not totally precise. I believe he got some info off of Youtube like 20th St (likely meant RPL's like Rudog mentioned), and Macias. doesn't appear to me he saw your threads but possibly. maybe we should try to get a hold of this guy and help each other out? Anyway, MFG is likely placed with relative accuracy on his map, I was just south of his placement on Lewis Rd I was considering that street within that boundary but cut it off by one street light, been years since I've been through there. it's not simple to even put together nowadays Downtown boundaries because the newer building apt complexes has been bringing in more progressive type of people, I know things have certainly changed on some blocks and the gangs have vacated certain spots their once kicked it at years ago.

[silentwssj]

Hey there ~J~, I agree, I think this guys map has merit. It is definitely not perfect but then again, I am sure ours is not either. All my knowledge is from 10 years ago so, yeah I am far from perfect myself. I wouldn't mind contacting him at some point. I am sure that he would like to add whatever we can come up with. He obviously spends a lot of time doing different maps for different cities. It would be pretty cool if we could all collaborate! I am honestly done with what I have to add. Whenever you guys feel that you are finished let me know and I will put it out there. Remember I can always change things as new information becomes available. It is not like it is set in stone! I am pretty sure that more people will add solid feedback once they get to see it.

[MMRbkaRudog]

Sent J a pm and I'm assuming you got mine Silent. Never really talked to him about the maps, other than just seeing his feedback on here. Was wondering about some things, but one main things is I told him I was thinking of replacing vnp with something else. Forgot to bring up VCL's. Not sure if J has heard anything, but I haven't heard anything about VCL's since the 90's. Only us bring up vcl's from what we remember in the 90's and those outdated lists. That's what I think Kevin saw, not necessarily on here.

[silentwssj]

I just PM'ed you Rudog! I am fine with adding or removing certain groups as long as we know the information to be legit. Lets make this as accurate as possible. Hopefully we can get some other SJ people to give some feedback. Especially on the southside. Peace out brothers! Lets try and finish this!

[~J~]

The second opinion on VCL's really didn't give me anything new about em but one thing is almost certain is they are likely inactive so with this understanding I leave it the Silent to make the call on that, also the boundary would still need some adjusting.
Also that seems like a lot of area for VTN but I don't know, some feedback from someone from Berryessa and NE SJ would also be nice.

[silentwssj]

Ok, I will take your guys word on it! Give me some dimensions if you can ~J~ for any adjustments to VCL's area. Also do you think that area is void of any groups right now. I just cant see nobody claiming Watson park at all. I wonder if some of the other groups that do claim the Northside have taken that territory? As far as VTN that is Rudogs area of expertise so I will leave that to his discretion. He is the one who mapped them out like that. Maybe you guys should PM one another to work out some kinks. I have been with both of you. How about this weekend we make a list of disputed areas and pm each other to see what we each think. Or we could just leave the Northside to ~J~, the westside to me, and the eastside to rudog. That might be a better solution. Let me know what you guys think!

[MMRbkaRudog]

I have less expertise in the north east side. I stretched out where Silent had vtn, to an area I know they're around. I know where one was staying and I think homie said that's their hood, so I'm not sure what we should do. Silent never told me if he felt his dimensions were right. He just said he didn't know the Berryessa area, but he still put some stuff up. I helped him with nps.

I wouldn't have known what to put in the Flickenger park are either, but I know there's some type of hood/s there. Some of the mapping I just figured general idea would be ok. That's way I originally put vst as one area, but it makes sense to break it down if they're broken down to 2 cliques in WSSJ. I just want to know what's the deal with intruders, if there's malos living in the area we had as intruders and they always tag malos in that area. I figured all WS VST were mls..

[KollmarVago408]

Winchester/ cadillac has always been malos . Intruders are a new clique maybe 5 years old with the tokers being their oldest but maybe smaller now a days . I would say wssj as it is today its a good 75% sureno area .

[silentwssj]

Het there Kollmar! Can you give some exact dimensions for the intruders click? Basically all four sides or streets of their area. I know that the area directly west of them is nice houses. I don't know how far those nice houses extend though. I honestly was thinking that there were some apts north of Williams st that was there main area. It is literally right across from the park but across Williams. How about east of san tomas expy? Basically if you can give me there honest dimensions that would be cool. Surenos on the west side 75%, That's stretching the truth some! Most of the westside is rich white folk! There are 3 main areas that have gang activity. #1 1st-bird, this is the main area. you got 2 norteno gangs and 2 sureno gangs. I would call that even. Most of that area is Norteno controlled to by the way! #2 west san carlos st. That is westside Mob territory with a sprinkling of VHS in there as well, straight Norteno! #3 Cadillac-eden and starbird park area. That area is straight sureno as far as I know. Although, I guarantee you there are a lot of Nortenos around there to, just not established gangs. That makes it about 50-50 in terms of gangs. In terms of shear numbers Nortenos outnumber Surenos for sure. This is San Jose not LA! There are plenty of N's walking around with no neighborhood ties. I do have a question for you though Kollmar. Have you ever heard of Varrio Mas Chingon being on the westside? I know them to be SSJ, but there have been questions brought up. Can you confirm or deny!

[silentwssj]

I have less expertise in the north east side. I stretched out where Silent had vtn, to an area I know they're around. I know where one was staying and I think homie said that's their hood, so I'm not sure what we should do. Silent never told me if he felt his dimensions were right. He just said he didn't know the Berryessa area, but he still put some stuff up. I helped him with nps.

I wouldn't have known what to put in the Flickenger park are either, but I know there's some type of hood/s there. Some of the mapping I just figured general idea would be ok. That's way I originally put vst as one area, but it makes sense to break it down if they're broken down to 2 cliques in WSSJ. I just want to know what's the deal with intruders, if there's malos living in the area we had as intruders and they always tag malos in that area. I figured all WS VST were mls..

Hey there! VTN I think that we can agree are in the area that I put. You stretched it some, but I believe you as that is your side of town. If you don't agree with my part of VTN's dimensions change them. Eastside is your baby Rudog. Flickinger park, I put them only around the park because I know there is a group that claims it. I only put the park because, I don't know if they have any territory besides the park. I do know that at least the park is right though.

[MMRbkaRudog]

We already got the intruders clique dimensions. KV gave us his dimensions and I went over it, so I think it's straight. I did wonder if it was like generational thing, because obviously all of ws vst basically were mls. Guess we could just call that area intruders tho, if that sounds right.

If you're bringing up how I thought vmc was in WSSJ, I think I was just confused. I did know that Negro claimed SSSJ, but forgot. At the same time I did hear of vmc being around Campbell, but maybe they just kicked it there or are another spread out gang? I do think of WSSJ when I think of Campbell, but Campbell is also near SSSJ. As long as we got a main area they claim, then I think we're fine. I'll have to see if I can figure out the north east side a little better and figure out what other types of sets belong on the map.

[MMRbkaRudog]

What do intruders tag for short? I know malos uses mls or stm and I believe tokers use tks.

[silentwssj]

Hey there Rudog! I am glad that we got consenus on VST thing. Honestly part of the Malos territory is in Campbell. The Malos area is split in two by both cities, so I think we got to put them in there even though it is a SJ map.Do what you think is appropriate with the eastside and VCL's on the Northside! I wont fight it anymore, if you are sure they are done then eliminate them. I did look up the release date on "City of sharks" by "Mr 21", It said april 2007. He talks about MFG's and 12th street in that song. I am not saying they are still active as I am not in SJ to confirm it. It is kind of suspicious that he would talk about them in a song just 7 years old. I think we should be real cautious with those two groups. I was in prison with a 12th member 11 years ago. I still have a feeling that they are around. They used to be pretty active in my day. I am willing to admit that I could be wrong though. I am definitely out of the loop being 2 states away for a decade! All I got to saying is we should know for sure before we leave them out. I would error on the side on inclusion rather than exclusion. We do know they both have history in SJ and for sure held territory. The worst that could be said if we are wrong is that they are an old gang. If we don't put them and they are still there we will look foolish! Eastbound Mob, if you know where they go then put em down! VMC, I never heard of them being on the westside. I could be wrong, but we cant map them there if we don't know where to put them. Lets try and finish this thing. Once it is out we can make more changes according to the feedback that we receive!

[youngspade]

Wow alonso this topic is your traffic.

[MMRbkaRudog]

Hey there Rudog! I am glad that we got consenus on VST thing. Honestly part of the Malos territory is in Campbell. The Malos area is split in two by both cities, so I think we got to put them in there even though it is a SJ map.Do what you think is appropriate with the eastside and VCL's on the Northside! I wont fight it anymore, if you are sure they are done then eliminate them. I did look up the release date on "City of sharks" by "Mr 21", It said april 2007. He talks about MFG's and 12th street in that song. I am not saying they are still active as I am not in SJ to confirm it. It is kind of suspicious that he would talk about them in a song just 7 years old. I think we should be real cautious with those two groups. I was in prison with a 12th member 11 years ago. I still have a feeling that they are around. They used to be pretty active in my day. I am willing to admit that I could be wrong though. I am definitely out of the loop being 2 states away for a decade! All I got to saying is we should know for sure before we leave them out. I would error on the side on inclusion rather than exclusion. We do know they both have history in SJ and for sure held territory. The worst that could be said if we are wrong is that they are an old gang. If we don't put them and they are still there we will look foolish! Eastbound Mob, if you know where they go then put em down! VMC, I never heard of them being on the westside. I could be wrong, but we cant map them there if we don't know where to put them. Lets try and finish this thing. Once it is out we can make more changes according to the feedback that we receive!

Well my expertise is ESSJ and I think I may have confused mfg's who have been mentioned in this millennium, so let's put them on. I do feel like something belongs on 12 and maybe 12 is around, but I'm guessing just no youngsters if they are. Maybe we could put them to. Would be nice to get some more feedback and it's probably been brought up, but can't remember all of our conversations on that. Some sets do go away tho, especially the ones who just end up being short lived and you even told a story about how you witnessed that. The older ones that die out just stop banging, so you know what I'm saying.

[MMRbkaRudog]

Oh yeah and I just listened to that Mr. 21 track. Sounded like he kind of dissed 7 trees, but he has a point. It's kind of confusing what's going on there, but I was thinking of just changing that area to "7 Trees Crips/14". For a long time I've just heard homeboys from that area just rep 7.

[~J~]

I adjusted the NS a bit, I think that's about right. 12St has a long history according to what Cricket was told and I'd take him at his word considering everything else added up, such a varrio with a reputation of taking care of business should be there! I'd put em back on until further notice, and MFG. I believe they're both around, probably on a lower profile but still there.

[MMRbkaRudog]

Seems like I'm having problems with the map now, but maybe I'm doing something different. Well here's something I came across:

The bottom left has Clanton n spv art. The art on the top right I believe was done by someone from vhs.

[MMRbkaRudog]

Seems like I'm having problems with the map now, but maybe I'm doing something different. Well here's something I came across:

The bottom left has Clanton n spv art. The art on the top right I believe was done by someone from vhs.

http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/NjkxWDkyMQ==/ ... N/$_57.JPG
It says Randy Vidal Jr. in the drawing and I believe he is from vhs, old school. Noticed how C13 has Virgina/Almaden? Is that where we had WSC? I can't seem to do anything with the map anymore. Do you know what's up Silent?

[silentwssj]

Hey there Rudog! Interesting picture that you have! Are those teen Angels? As far as them putting up Virginia and Almaden. I would definitely call that area SSP. You have got to realize that both SSP and C14 are next door neighbors. The only spot that either group can go to and kick it with relative safety is Washington elementary school. If you listen to Grump dog "San Jonero, Clantonero" He talks about kicking back at that spot. I can verify it as I witnessed it during that era. I had a good homeboy that lived in the heart of that area and I was there almost on a daily basis. Grump dog also talks about us and WSM in that song. He calls us "Varrio Horseshit" LOL! Westside Mob is referred to as westside Marikas! LOL! In that song he basically calls SSP their Camaradas, There is a verse that goes something like this when talking about us. "Camaradas from SSP doing drive by's in the Coche en La Noche!" Almaden Rd was their hot spot. In my opinion it is because that Rd runs through the center of there area and right next to the school. They held the territory east and west of this RD. It is a one way street, you can only travel north bound on it. This made it very defensible for them. If you wanted to creep up on them it was harder to do as all the east-west streets had major streets in between them. Almaden and Vine are only one block apart. They are both one way streets. Both of those streets cross Willow and W Virginia st. Believe me you can get hung up at the red lights trying to cross Vine-Almaden at either Virginia or willow. There are alleys that go in between those blocks and they use them to attack and retreat quickly through the middle of the block without being seen! The reason that I am explaining all of this to you is because both SSP and C14 share the area. C14 is concentrated around willow-Goodyear and SSP is just slightly North of them. They both use the benches at Washington Elementary to hang out. They both sit in front of the Library on 1st and they both play handball behind it. From the school, Virginia is only a couple blocks north and Willow is only a couple blocks south. Almaden RD is a major spot that both groups roam up and down. basically, because it runs through the middle of both of their territory's and is very defensible. I know all of this because well, I was there! The territory's of those groups are so close and their relations are so tight that you can basically overlap them. I don't want to do that on the map because, there is a difference and we should strive to be accurate! I am sure that both groups have members living throughout both areas. I am also sure that both groups actively patrol each others areas for purposes of mutual defense! To be honest with you they are basically two gangs sharing one big area. As I said before though, C14 really claims willow-goodyear, that is their main spot! Virginia-Amaden is only 4 blocks north and In territory friendly to them, so the picture does not surprise me. I think it should have said willow-Almaden though. I used to see large packs of Surenos on weekend nights hanging out in front of the Mexican restaurant on Virginia-Almaden, Willow-almaden by the donut shop, and especially Oak-Almaden in front the apartments on the corner. Lots of things would happen around that area from both sides! They would post up and use the alleys and school for quick attacks and quick retreats! Nortenos would have to roll up Almaden and face them head on because of the one way St! Gun shots were heard ringing out nightly especially on weekends. I honestly think some of the most vicious battles that San Jo has witnessed between Nortenos and Surenos happened in this area.

As far as as 12th st and MFG's why don't I just put them back on. I can remove them later if new information comes to light. VCL's, I trimmed way down according to what ~J~ told me. If you guys know they are done for a fact then remove them. If not we should keep them there just in case. If anything it will serve as a historical reference. As I said before, I would hate to remove someone and still have them there. Even if we are wrong and they are gone all someone can say is they are an old gang that for sure used to occupy that spot.

[MMRbkaRudog]

Hey there Rudog! Interesting picture that you have! Are those teen Angels? As far as them putting up Virginia and Almaden. I would definitely call that area SSP. You have got to realize that both SSP and C14 are next door neighbors. The only spot that either group can go to and kick it with relative safety is Washington elementary school. If you listen to Grump dog "San Jonero, Clantonero" He talks about kicking back at that spot. I can verify it as I witnessed it during that era. I had a good homeboy that lived in the heart of that area and I was there almost on a daily basis. Grump dog also talks about us and WSM in that song. He calls us "Varrio Horseshit" LOL! Westside Mob is referred to as westside Marikas! LOL! In that song he basically calls SSP their Camaradas, There is a verse that goes something like this when talking about us. "Camaradas from SSP doing drive by's in the Coche en La Noche!" Almaden Rd was their hot spot. In my opinion it is because that Rd runs through the center of there area and right next to the school. They held the territory east and west of this RD. It is a one way street, you can only travel north bound on it. This made it very defensible for them. If you wanted to creep up on them it was harder to do as all the east-west streets had major streets in between them. Almaden and Vine are only one block apart. They are both one way streets. Both of those streets cross Willow and W Virginia st. Believe me you can get hung up at the red lights trying to cross Vine-Almaden at either Virginia or willow. There are alleys that go in between those blocks and they use them to attack and retreat quickly through the middle of the block without being seen! The reason that I am explaining all of this to you is because both SSP and C14 share the area. C14 is concentrated around willow-Goodyear and SSP is just slightly North of them. They both use the benches at Washington Elementary to hang out. They both sit in front of the Library on 1st and they both play handball behind it. From the school, Virginia is only a couple blocks north and Willow is only a couple blocks south. Almaden RD is a major spot that both groups roam up and down. basically, because it runs through the middle of both of their territory's and is very defensible. I know all of this because well, I was there! The territory's of those groups are so close and their relations are so tight that you can basically overlap them. I don't want to do that on the map because, there is a difference and we should strive to be accurate! I am sure that both groups have members living throughout both areas. I am also sure that both groups actively patrol each others areas for purposes of mutual defense! To be honest with you they are basically two gangs sharing one big area. As I said before though, C14 really claims willow-goodyear, that is their main spot! Virginia-Amaden is only 4 blocks north and In territory friendly to them, so the picture does not surprise me. I think it should have said willow-Almaden though. I used to see large packs of Surenos on weekend nights hanging out in front of the Mexican restaurant on Virginia-Almaden, Willow-almaden by the donut shop, and especially Oak-Almaden in front the apartments on the corner. Lots of things would happen around that area from both sides! They would post up and use the alleys and school for quick attacks and quick retreats! Nortenos would have to roll up Almaden and face them head on because of the one way St! Gun shots were heard ringing out nightly especially on weekends. I honestly think some of the most vicious battles that San Jo has witnessed between Nortenos and Surenos happened in this area.

As far as as 12th st and MFG's why don't I just put them back on. I can remove them later if new information comes to light. VCL's, I trimmed way down according to what ~J~ told me. If you guys know they are done for a fact then remove them. If not we should keep them there just in case. If anything it will serve as a historical reference. As I said before, I would hate to remove someone and still have them there. Even if we are wrong and they are gone all someone can say is they are an old gang that for sure used to occupy that spot.

Yeah those are teen angels and I yeah, let's put them on. Me knowing so much about ESSJ and even having J co-sign from his NSSJ point of view, I think we should take vcl's off.

[silentwssj]

Ok! I will do it right now! I put 12th st, back on and MFG's as well. If you can lets get the Eastside where you want it. I would like to put the map out there ASAP! Do you know the dimensions of East bound Mob? They should probably be included. I know Kevin's map has the down, but can you confirm it?

[MMRbkaRudog]

Ok! I will do it right now! I put 12th st, back on and MFG's as well. If you can lets get the Eastside where you want it. I would like to put the map out there ASAP! Do you know the dimensions of East bound Mob? They should probably be included. I know Kevin's map has the down, but can you confirm it?

It's not letting me edit. Did you change the options? I also noticed map #1 just has mapping, with no names. Are you convinced you want to stick with map 1? Another thing I was going to mention was how I like how map 2 does show that vst stretches out to Campbell.

[silentwssj]

Hey there! I notice that the map makes me sign in and out on an almost daily basis. I will check it right now. I did not change the settings though. Let me try and fix it. Honestly, I like both maps! They both have their own unique style. I have been making changes to map #1, but not #2. I consider map #2 your baby, but I will be more than happy to fix things if you want. My feeling is that we should put Map #1 out there ASAP! Map #2 we can put out when you are ready! Hopefully we can get some serious feedback and make more changes. I don't want titles to cover the neighborhoods on map#1, To me that looks to cluttered, especially when you zoom out. I wouldn't mind having the neighborhoods labeled on the side bar though. I notice that you did that on map #2. Can you do it on map #1 for me, or at least give me directions and I will do it tonight. Remember I only want the side bar labeled though.

[~J~]

I didn't know you had a map #2 Silent lol shoot the link

I like the way you mapped out MFG, between my vague memory and what Kevin's map shows I think you got a good medium there.

I'm done with the NS although I'm not quite sure where RPL's North border starts, they're probably occupying a few streets where VNH use to have members back in the day along Julian. I think I fixed everything there pretty good for you...

[silentwssj]

Hey there my brother! Yes, we have been working on a second map! This one has the sides of town marked! It also has each neighborhood with its title placed across its territory! Pretty cool! Check your PM and I will shoot you a link right now!

[MMRbkaRudog]

I would like to just keep it one, so it can be which ever you want. Maybe we can make #2 just a map for the sides of town? It is pretty kool, cuzz I don't think I ever seen anything quite like it.

[silentwssj]

Hey ~J~ did you ever get the link to work? Rudog has been experiencing some editing problems! What do you think of the second version?

[MMRbkaRudog]

Silent, the new map seems pretty much like the 1st one. I'm going to have to see if I can edit it on another comp.. How has it been for you?

Saw vCX3 tagged on Meridian/Willow today. I noticed how close that was to Willow ST park. What's with C13 and that area? Are they claiming that as part of their hood these days?

[silentwssj]

Hey There! I think they consider Willow St, there territory! It seems funny to me because most of Willow St is nice homes. Especially that area around the park. I have never personally witnessed any Surenos over there. As I said before, I used to chill there at night sometimes to Bone bitches or drink. It is a real mellow spot. No gang activity. If the police roll up they cant find you. It is to easy to slip into the trees where the old creek bed is. Where was the tag? I am guessing by the donut store or gas station. It is funny how they use C13 over in SJ but C14 everywhere else. To me Willow St, East of the tracks is C14 area. West of the tracks is VHS. Obviously, they think they own all of Willow, good area or bad, LOL!

[MMRbkaRudog]

Hey There! I think they consider Willow St, there territory! It seems funny to me because most of Willow St is nice homes. Especially that area around the park. I have never personally witnessed any Surenos over there. As I said before, I used to chill there at night sometimes to Bone bitches or drink. It is a real mellow spot. No gang activity. If the police roll up they cant find you. It is to easy to slip into the trees where the old creek bed is. Where was the tag? I am guessing by the donut store or gas station. It is funny how they use C13 over in SJ but C14 everywhere else. To me Willow St, East of the tracks is C14 area. West of the tracks is VHS. Obviously, they think they own all of Willow, good area or bad, LOL!

Yeah it was on the wall of the donut shop. They mainly use C13 outside of LA I guess, especially in SJ for reasons that should be obvious. Mainly they use C14 in LA, but I think they should have just stuck with Clanton. They added 14, because Clanton ST was renamed 14 ST..

[silentwssj]

I have looked at numerous pictures of theirs! There tattoos could honestly be mistaken for being Norteno! I am sure that is why they use 13 up in SJ. I have found tons of pictures of them through there social media websites. I looked again the other day and couldn't find them. I bet if I looked further I may get what I was looking for. All the members of SJ's C14 were in these photos! They sure do like to wear Sharks gear! That is probably what keeps them alive. Most Nortenos probably drive right by them thinking they are a fellow N! They are not very smart either. Those pictures could be used for gang enhancements later. Not to mention, Any rival could see who there enemies are! It cracks me up to know they are tagging around Meridian ave! That is equivalent to tagging up Beverly Hills! The only area around there that they could possibly be living in is the Apts across the street from the wiernersnitzel! Those are pretty nice to by the way!