Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

American organized crime groups included traditional groups such as La Cosa Nostra & the Italian Mafia to modern groups such as Black Mafia Family. Discuss the most organized criminal groups in the United States including gangs in Canada.
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Azure9920
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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by Azure9920 » February 5th, 2009, 1:57 pm

CheGuevara wrote: And yes, Rudaj does hold up water. He bitch slapped LCN families left and right. He stuck a gun at Arnold and then took over his club right after that in retaliation to his failed scare tactic.
http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/nys/pressrele ... tionpr.pdf

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by CheGuevara » February 5th, 2009, 2:50 pm

Whats you're point Azure? Rudaj is behind bars now? Okay, congratulations to him. How does this effect what he did to the LCN though? He took over all of the gambling operations the Lucchese family had in Astoria. They shut down a Gambino controlled club in Astoria after they had a confrontation with Arnold Squitieri [acting boss of the Gambino Crime Family] and disrepected him by not bowing down and pointing a gun at him, and threatening to kill everyone if they do not back away.


annnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnyway, Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese. Is Sonny in jail and whats Suge's fat ass up to?

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by Azure9920 » February 5th, 2009, 4:02 pm

CheGuevara wrote:Whats you're point Azure? Rudaj is behind bars now? Okay, congratulations to him. How does this effect what he did to the LCN though? He took over all of the gambling operations the Lucchese family had in Astoria. They shut down a Gambino controlled club in Astoria after they had a confrontation with Arnold Squitieri [acting boss of the Gambino Crime Family] and disrepected him by not bowing down and pointing a gun at him, and threatening to kill everyone if they do not back away.


annnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnyway, Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese. Is Sonny in jail and whats Suge's fat ass up to?
More specifically, "armed members of the
Rudaj Organization met with members of the Gambino Crime Family at
a gas station in New Jersey for a standoff, and DEDAJ pointed a gun
at the gas pumps and threatened to blow everyone up."

If I'm not mistaken, Sonny was recently paroled, but is still under indictment with the acting boss of the Colombo family, Tommy Shots. Suge Knight is bankrupt, and going through a couple trials involving domestic disputes and a lawsuit against Kanye West, unless they've been cleared up recently.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by Richboy17 » February 5th, 2009, 4:06 pm

CheGuevara wrote:Whats you're point Azure? Rudaj is behind bars now? Okay, congratulations to him. How does this effect what he did to the LCN though? He took over all of the gambling operations the Lucchese family had in Astoria. They shut down a Gambino controlled club in Astoria after they had a confrontation with Arnold Squitieri [acting boss of the Gambino Crime Family] and disrepected him by not bowing down and pointing a gun at him, and threatening to kill everyone if they do not back away.


annnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnyway, Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese. Is Sonny in jail and whats Suge's fat ass up to?
Suge got his ass beat by some random barber in South Central, but this was like last year. Suge aint got no money no more and he has barely any power. I think 50 Cent got more power over Suge now.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by CheGuevara » February 5th, 2009, 7:11 pm

Suge got his ass beat by some random barber in South Central, but this was like last year. Suge aint got no money no more and he has barely any power. I think 50 Cent got more power over Suge now.


G-g-g-g-g-g-g-g Unit

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by CheGuevara » February 5th, 2009, 7:16 pm

More specifically, "armed members of the
Rudaj Organization met with members of the Gambino Crime Family at
a gas station in New Jersey for a standoff, and DEDAJ pointed a gun
at the gas pumps and threatened to blow everyone up."
At Mr. Squitieri's signal, about 30 of his men appeared, carrying bats, guns and other weapons, but the Albanians were ready. One of Mr. Rudaj's men put a gun to Mr. Squitieri's head and another pointed a shotgun at a gas pump, threatening to blow everyone up unless Mr. Squitieri's men put down their guns, according to prosecutors.

Mr. Squitieri backed down.
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/03/nyreg ... ref=slogin

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by thewestside » February 5th, 2009, 10:44 pm

CheGuevara wrote:I never doubted that Sonny told him off. So what the hell is you're dumbass talking about now?
You were getting after me for "simply copying or pasting" things. I said that it was better to copy or paste actual sources than just make shit up and talk out of my ass like you do. Understand?
Its better if you say in the PAST and dont mix up the current status of the LCN with the past like you usually do. If you are too stupid to understand what I mean [which is usually the case] I will explain it.

You have a knack of talking about the LCN in the past and going to the current times in the next sentence making it seem like the LCN is still doing what you said they are in the last sentence. Stop doing that.
Give me a single example of where I have stated something about the LCN presently that is from the past.
Is the LCN making living costs higher in New York RIGHT NOW IN 2009? NO!


Uh....yes it is. I've provided articles and quotes by FBI officials in the past about the continued "mob tax" New Yorkers pay because of organized crime influence. You've just always dismissed them. Is it as much as it was 10 or 20 years ago? By no means. But it is still there.
So do not bring it up unless we asked you to. We are talking about the Los Zetas and others in comparison to the LCN RIGHT NOW! We arent comparing the LCN in 1956 to the Rudaj organization now.
The only one who brought up the Rudaj gang was you. You always try to find a way to squeeze him into just about every conversation about organized crime.
And yes, Rudaj does hold up water. He bitch slapped LCN families left and right. He stuck a gun at Arnold and then took over his club right after that in retaliation to his failed scare tactic. Not to mention he went after the Lucchese and Colombo family as well. So scuk it. You and you're LCN.
Bitch slapped LCN families left and right? LOL! You are hilarious the way you pump Rudaj up.

Rudaj took over two Greek clubs that were paying tribute to the Gambino and Lucchese families. I've asked you before, if he was so big and bad, why he didn't go after any LCN clubs directly. You've never been able to give a straight answer to this. And once again, he never had any encounters with the Colombo family. It was a low level Bonanno associate he shot. As far as the gas station meeting, Squitieri pointed his gun at Rudaj. I've read other accounts that Rudaj also pointed a gun back at Squitieri. One of Rudaj's guys pointed his shotgun at a gas pump in order to get all the Gambino guys to back off, which they did. You like to see this as some great triumph but it really wasn't. But then again, you're the guy who thinks Rudaj "taking over" John Gotti's old table at Rao's was something special. Your problem is you've read to many hyped up articles on Rudaj. Try reading the actual indictment of the Rudaj crew. It gives the facts as they stood, without any embellishment. And while the indictment does mention the beatings the Rudaj guys gave to Greek operators in the Stamatis and Soccer fever clubs, it mentions nothing about beating up any made men.
It is all about money but the Mexican gangs are willing to use more violence then the LCN.
True, but as I've explained before, that is not necessarily a sign of weakness on the part of the LCN. But more one of sophistication.
Whats you're point Azure? Rudaj is behind bars now? Okay, congratulations to him. How does this effect what he did to the LCN though? He took over all of the gambling operations the Lucchese family had in Astoria. They shut down a Gambino controlled club in Astoria after they had a confrontation with Arnold Squitieri [acting boss of the Gambino Crime Family] and disrepected him by not bowing down and pointing a gun at him, and threatening to kill everyone if they do not back away.
What "he did" to the LCN? In the long run, he didn't do anything. You really think what he did matters on the street right now? And there you go again blowing it all out of proportion. Rudaj did not "take over all" of the Lucchese family's gambling operations in Queens. He took over one Greek club that was paying tribute to the Lucchese family! You see what I mean about your never ending BS? And for the record, the meeting with Squitieri at the gas station in New Jersey came after the Rudaj guys shut down the Soccer Fever club. In fact, that's what sparked the meeting in the first place.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by CheGuevara » February 6th, 2009, 10:38 am

You were getting after me for "simply copying or pasting" things. I said that it was better to copy or paste actual sources than just make shit up and talk out of my ass like you do. Understand?
And I was just telling the guy who said bravo thewestside to congratulate Richboy17 not you because he was the one who posted the same source in the very beginning and said you just did what you always do which is copy and paste. Understand?
Uh....yes it is. I've provided articles and quotes by FBI officials in the past about the continued "mob tax" New Yorkers pay because of organized crime influence. You've just always dismissed them. Is it as much as it was 10 or 20 years ago? By no means. But it is still there.
What's the tax? 0.00001% of the old buildings in the lower left side of the Bronx
True, but as I've explained before, that is not necessarily a sign of weakness on the part of the LCN. But more one of sophistication.
One more of being a btich.
What "he did" to the LCN? In the long run, he didn't do anything. You really think what he did matters on the street right now? And there you go again blowing it all out of proportion. Rudaj did not "take over all" of the Lucchese family's gambling operations in Queens. He took over one Greek club that was paying tribute to the Lucchese family! You see what I mean about your never ending BS? And for the record, the meeting with Squitieri at the gas station in New Jersey came after the Rudaj guys shut down the Soccer Fever club. In fact, that's what sparked the meeting in the first place.
In June 2001, the evidence at trial established, the
Rudaj Organization violently seized control over illegal gambling
operations in Astoria, Queens
– territory which formerly had been
controlled by the Lucchese Crime Family.


the six defendants and numerous
other members and associates of the Rudaj Organization, armed with
firearms, stormed a rival gambling establishment opened by a
Gambino Family associate and shut it down. The evidence also
established that the Rudaj Organization committed numerous other
acts of violence and intimidation to maintain and expand their
control of illegal gambling in Astoria.


It did not mention any person getting beat up by name or job title. But the FBI stated that they beat up made men. I choose to believe them. You do not because you cannot take it in that Albanians were courageous enough to beat up members of the all mighty god like La Cosa Nostra in America.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by Azure9920 » February 6th, 2009, 8:27 pm

CheGuevara wrote:Whats you're point Azure? Rudaj is behind bars now? Okay, congratulations to him. How does this effect what he did to the LCN though? He took over all of the gambling operations the Lucchese family had in Astoria. They shut down a Gambino controlled club in Astoria after they had a confrontation with Arnold Squitieri [acting boss of the Gambino Crime Family] and disrepected him by not bowing down and pointing a gun at him, and threatening to kill everyone if they do not back away.
Spiros Velentzas= Lucchese.

lol

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by CheGuevara » February 6th, 2009, 10:48 pm

Greeks are pieces of shit that feed off the weak in time of despair. It's been their history and will be their future. These people went to Egypt and claimed they built the Pyraminds and Spinx without ever being there.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by thewestside » February 7th, 2009, 12:54 am

CheGuevara wrote:What's the tax? 0.00001% of the old buildings in the lower left side of the Bronx
Typical snide comment from a pouting 17 year old who's pissed because Albanians are not at the top. To answer your question, in the construction industry for instance, the mob tax is reported to be 2%.
One more of being a btich.
Another snide remark because you ain't got anything to say.
In June 2001, the evidence at trial established, the
Rudaj Organization violently seized control over illegal gambling
operations in Astoria, Queens
– territory which formerly had been
controlled by the Lucchese Crime Family.


the six defendants and numerous
other members and associates of the Rudaj Organization, armed with
firearms, stormed a rival gambling establishment opened by a
Gambino Family associate and shut it down. The evidence also
established that the Rudaj Organization committed numerous other
acts of violence and intimidation to maintain and expand their
control of illegal gambling in Astoria.
There you go again going to 2nd hand articles rather than going to the source itself - the indictment. The only gambling operations Rudaj took over, that were mob connected anyway, were the Stamatis and Soccer Fever clubs. Hardly "all" of either the Lucchese or Gambino family's gambling operations in Astoria.
It did not mention any person getting beat up by name or job title. But the FBI stated that they beat up made men. I choose to believe them. You do not because you cannot take it in that Albanians were courageous enough to beat up members of the all mighty god like La Cosa Nostra in America.
Like I've said many times before, you believe the FBI only when it suits you. I'll believe the Rudaj guy actually beat up made guys when I see their names. No names of any made guys have ever been listed anywhere - not in the indictment and not in any articles. The only record of guys getting beat up were Greek operators of the clubs.
Greeks are pieces of shit that feed off the weak in time of despair. It's been their history and will be their future. These people went to Egypt and claimed they built the Pyraminds and Spinx without ever being there.
The Greeks have been one of the most prominent and influential nations in history. Why do you think Greek and Roman history is taught so much in school? This coming from an Albanian. Give me a break. Your ignorance knows no bounds.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by NateDogg » February 7th, 2009, 1:41 am

Richboy17 wrote:
IronManCash10 wrote:shut the fu-- up. you have no idea what your talking about. are you in the people nation forreal? bangin in your special ed class? lol your a fuckin faggot. p diddy shot that motherfucker basically out of self defense. he aint ever robbed or extorted anybody or force people to give up contracts like suge did. so t.i having guns makes him a gangster too? oh damn he had silencers too? lol hes a super gangster now
Puff Daddy aint shit he might have power because he has money but he aint gangster, 50 Cent is more gangster than him. What people dont realize is 50 Cent has a lot of power and i dont care what people say about him. He has rappers/gangsters from basically every hood sucking his dick because he got so much money and has so much influence. You know how big GUnit is? #%@& 50 got Surenos down with Gunit on the West Coast. But Suge Knight was a real gangster he acted like one and moved like one. He had cops on his payroll, had people killed, extorted, and laundered drug money for gangs/organizations. He was strictly organized crime, when you have gangbangers from LA elevate in the criminal world that is scary, but its funny how a mob boss bitched his ass out.
50 got Surenos down with G-unit for real?

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by NateDogg » February 7th, 2009, 1:41 am

Richboy17 wrote:
IronManCash10 wrote:shut the fu-- up. you have no idea what your talking about. are you in the people nation forreal? bangin in your special ed class? lol your a fuckin faggot. p diddy shot that motherfucker basically out of self defense. he aint ever robbed or extorted anybody or force people to give up contracts like suge did. so t.i having guns makes him a gangster too? oh damn he had silencers too? lol hes a super gangster now
Puff Daddy aint shit he might have power because he has money but he aint gangster, 50 Cent is more gangster than him. What people dont realize is 50 Cent has a lot of power and i dont care what people say about him. He has rappers/gangsters from basically every hood sucking his dick because he got so much money and has so much influence. You know how big GUnit is? #%@& 50 got Surenos down with Gunit on the West Coast. But Suge Knight was a real gangster he acted like one and moved like one. He had cops on his payroll, had people killed, extorted, and laundered drug money for gangs/organizations. He was strictly organized crime, when you have gangbangers from LA elevate in the criminal world that is scary, but its funny how a mob boss bitched his ass out.
50 got Surenos down with G-unit for real?

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by CheGuevara » February 7th, 2009, 9:11 am

Typical snide comment from a pouting 17 year old who's pissed because Albanians are not at the top. To answer your question, in the construction industry for instance, the mob tax is reported to be 2%.
So the mob taxes 2% of New York's construction but somehow made men live a regular life in a regular house in a regular car complaining about not having money. Hmmm, is this like 80% of European cocaine coming through Reggio Calabria? Is this the same thing like that?
There you go again going to 2nd hand articles rather than going to the source itself - the indictment. The only gambling operations Rudaj took over, that were mob connected anyway, were the Stamatis and Soccer Fever clubs. Hardly "all" of either the Lucchese or Gambino family's gambling operations in Astoria.
THAT WAS FROM THE INDICTMENT YOU IDIOT! I copied and pasted directly what was posted on the Rudaj Conviction letter.
Like I've said many times before, you believe the FBI only when it suits you. I'll believe the Rudaj guy actually beat up made guys when I see their names. No names of any made guys have ever been listed anywhere - not in the indictment and not in any articles. The only record of guys getting beat up were Greek operators of the clubs.
Sure. In other words. You will only believe the FBI if they state exactly who, what, where, when and why? If they just say what, you will not believe them? Seems reasonable... :)
The Greeks have been one of the most prominent and influential nations in history. Why do you think Greek and Roman history is taught so much in school? This coming from an Albanian. Give me a break. Your ignorance knows no bounds.
Greeks are leaches. People from Cyprus are much better. Technically they are Greeks too but they are much better people and they hate Greeks from Greece. Yeah I know Greek history is taught a lot, I have read a lot about it in my World History class, and they have been leaches since the beginning of time.

And yes that is coming from an Albanian. Some of the most honorable people you will ever meet.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by thewestside » February 8th, 2009, 2:55 am

CheGuevara wrote:So the mob taxes 2% of New York's construction but somehow made men live a regular life in a regular house in a regular car complaining about not having money. Hmmm, is this like 80% of European cocaine coming through Reggio Calabria? Is this the same thing like that?
You obviously don't understand how the particulars work. It's just like the tax put on the garbage industry or garment center when the mob controlled those. Not every dollar goes into the pockets of the mobsters themselves. Much of it goes to the companies that the Mafia works through. For example, before the garbage cartel was dismantled in the mid-1990's, authorities estimated that the mob added an extra $500 million to the $1 billion carting business in New York. But this was through direct or indirect control of hundreds of garbage companies. Officials estimated that 10-20% of that, or $50-100 million, actually went to the Mafia itself. The "mob tax" is simply the added costs that are the result of organized crime influence in a given industry.

LOL! How long are you going to try and milk this Reggio Calabria thing? Various government sources in Europe have said that was the case at least at one time. You have not proven them wrong, even if other routes such as Spain have now supplanted it. Either way, the Italians still control it. You are simply becoming more and more desperate in your attempts to discredit me. It's truly pathetic.
THAT WAS FROM THE INDICTMENT YOU IDIOT! I copied and pasted directly what was posted on the Rudaj Conviction letter.
Well first, the conviction press release is not the indictment. But in any event I've read the press release before and provided the link below. It doesn't say that the Rudaj gang took over "all" of the Lucchese's gambling operations in Astoria. That is simply what you read into it. You do that all the time. You add your own little twist into something the officials say, probably hoping nobody will notice.

http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/nys/pressrele ... cingpr.pdf
Sure. In other words. You will only believe the FBI if they state exactly who, what, where, when and why? If they just say what, you will not believe them? Seems reasonable... :)
No, I would simply like to see some more evidence about these supposed made men the Rudaj gang beat up. Why weren't these viscious assaults among the charges in the indictment? The only assaults in the indictment were those upon the Greek operators of the two clubs.
Greeks are leaches. People from Cyprus are much better. Technically they are Greeks too but they are much better people and they hate Greeks from Greece. Yeah I know Greek history is taught a lot, I have read a lot about it in my World History class, and they have been leaches since the beginning of time.


They have contributed more to the world and western civilization than Albanians ever will.
And yes that is coming from an Albanian. Some of the most honorable people you will ever meet.
Well, if that's true, you're not one of them. The reputation you have for dishonesty is certainly not honorable. Nor is your worship of the criminals amongst the Albanian people. Like Ronnie, who used to defend you in the past said, you are a disgrace to your own people.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by thewestside » February 8th, 2009, 2:56 am

To clarify the last sentence in the above post (since I can't edit it)

Like Ronnie said, who used to defend you in the past said, you are a disgrace to your own people.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by CheGuevara » February 8th, 2009, 10:23 am

LOL! How long are you going to try and milk this Reggio Calabria thing? Various government sources in Europe have said that was the case at least at one time. You have not proven them wrong, even if other routes such as Spain have now supplanted it. Either way, the Italians still control it. You are simply becoming more and more desperate in your attempts to discredit me. It's truly pathetic.
I find it funny how just because government reports say something. You find it true.
Well first, the conviction press release is not the indictment. But in any event I've read the press release before and provided the link below. It doesn't say that the Rudaj gang took over "all" of the Lucchese's gambling operations in Astoria. That is simply what you read into it. You do that all the time. You add your own little twist into something the officials say, probably hoping nobody will notice.

http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/nys/pressrele ... cingpr.pdf
It said they violently seized control of gambling operations in Astoria once controlled by the Lucchese family.
No, I would simply like to see some more evidence about these supposed made men the Rudaj gang beat up. Why weren't these viscious assaults among the charges in the indictment? The only assaults in the indictment were those upon the Greek operators of the two clubs.
It did not mention anyone getting beat up by ethnicity or name. But made men were one of the many that were slapped.
They have contributed more to the world and western civilization than Albanians ever will.
Rome can thank who for saving their asses 500 years ago? Exactly, you dont know shit about anything. All you can do is run you're ignorant Italian-American mouth.
Well, if that's true, you're not one of them. The reputation you have for dishonesty is certainly not honorable. Nor is your worship of the criminals amongst the Albanian people. Like Ronnie, who used to defend you in the past said, you are a disgrace to your own people.
Well Ronnie never said that but its okay for you to say he did because I expect it from someone like you. Ronnie did however say, that you try to pass yourself off as a world class crime historian but you hype the Italians up while you downsize everyone else.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by Azure9920 » February 8th, 2009, 12:15 pm

Sidenote- How did Albania(ns)(Who you're referring to?) "save" Romes ass 500 years ago?

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by CheGuevara » February 8th, 2009, 3:33 pm

Who supressed the Ottomans from traveling overseas to Rome for over 50 years? Who notified them?

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by thewestside » February 9th, 2009, 3:08 pm

CheGuevara wrote:It said they violently seized control of gambling operations in Astoria once controlled by the Lucchese family.
What operations? The only one that was listed in the indictment was the Stamatis club. That's it. But you're only too happy to assume there were more even though there is no mention of them. And for the record, Stamatis was under the control of Greek operators and was simply paying a tax to the Luccheses.
It did not mention anyone getting beat up by ethnicity or name. But made men were one of the many that were slapped.
From all I've read about the situation, it was Greek operators who were physically attacked. It was them who ran the clubs directly. No mention of any specific made guys being attacked. And I can't help but notice how you've gone from Rudaj "beating the living hell" out of made men to simply "slapping" them.
Rome can thank who for saving their asses 500 years ago? Exactly, you dont know shit about anything. All you can do is run you're ignorant Italian-American mouth.
You know I'm not Italian. And I don't have to be to see this clearly. Both the Greeks and Italians have had a much wider influence on the world than Albanians ever will. Many nations have, which is why you have such an inferiority complex about your Albanian heritage.
Well Ronnie never said that but its okay for you to say he did because I expect it from someone like you. Ronnie did however say, that you try to pass yourself off as a world class crime historian but you hype the Italians up while you downsize everyone else.
Go back and read his posts. He only initially came to your side because he had a soft spot for Albanians and felt you were being picked on. But it didn't take long for him to see that what you were saying about Albanian OC was overhyped BS and that you were giving your fellow Albanians a bad name. In the end, he agreed with me on both counts and was one of your biggest critics.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by CheGuevara » February 9th, 2009, 4:20 pm

What operations? The only one that was listed in the indictment was the Stamatis club. That's it. But you're only too happy to assume there were more even though there is no mention of them. And for the record, Stamatis was under the control of Greek operators and was simply paying a tax to the Luccheses.
Downsize it as much as you want. It doesnt matter to me anymore. You can never take AOC and IOC and compare it in a normal fasion because you are too pitiful and too angry at me to tell these people the truth.
From all I've read about the situation, it was Greek operators who were physically attacked. It was them who ran the clubs directly. No mention of any specific made guys being attacked. And I can't help but notice how you've gone from Rudaj "beating the living hell" out of made men to simply "slapping" them.
So the FBI is wrong?

Rudaj first beat the living hell out of them, then he took their hands and slapped them with their own hands and told them, "Stop hitting yourself, do all Lucchese guys slapp themselves? Stop hitting yourself". Gjelosh Lelcaj was there with Nardino and they were both shitting themselves. Then Miri Patani came in and said, "You got the knocked the fcuk out!" Sort of like this.


You know I'm not Italian. And I don't have to be to see this clearly. Both the Greeks and Italians have had a much wider influence on the world than Albanians ever will. Many nations have, which is why you have such an inferiority complex about your Albanian heritage.
If you ever met an Albanian. You would realize that they will not feel one inch less important then you. After a while of spending time with him or her, you will realize that most Albanians feel surperior then other people or ethnicities. And they have a reason to feel that way. If Albanians felt inferior or if I felt inferior, I would not have an Albanian eagle on my chest and Albanians would not hold that flag up or talk about Albania as much as they do.


Go back and read his posts. He only initially came to your side because he had a soft spot for Albanians and felt you were being picked on. But it didn't take long for him to see that what you were saying about Albanian OC was overhyped BS and that you were giving your fellow Albanians a bad name. In the end, he agreed with me on both counts and was one of your biggest critics.
He never agreed with you. And again, Ronnie's biggest problem with me was the KLA subject that we were talking about which you were not even in. He told me I was hyping up the KLA by saying they had 100,000 members at their height. Also, those were my JohnnyRed days am I correct. And you only recently came into the forum at that time. At that point in time. It was only Sentenza, Nickels, Razbojnik [under KCF_for_life] talking about Russia controlling the world, blacks all being ballers moving 4000 metric tonnes of cocaine in one day and Macedonian Crime lords making 12 trillion a year. It was a different time and my responses and posts did not reflect my real insights and/or thoughts and knowledge.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by thewestside » February 9th, 2009, 4:26 pm

CheGuevara wrote:Downsize it as much as you want. It doesnt matter to me anymore. You can never take AOC and IOC and compare it in a normal fasion because you are too pitiful and too angry at me to tell these people the truth.
I'm not trying to downsize anything. I'm going with the available facts. And there is only the Stamatis club. You are simply going by a general reference at best because it suits your argument.
So the FBI is wrong?
I didn't say they were wrong. I said I would like to see more information about this and wonder why the attacks upon made LCN members, even if by general reference only, were not mentioned in the indictment.
Rudaj first beat the living hell out of them, then he took their hands and slapped them with their own hands and told them, "Stop hitting yourself, do all Lucchese guys slapp themselves? Stop hitting yourself". Gjelosh Lelcaj was there with Nardino and they were both shitting themselves. Then Miri Patani came in and said, "You got the knocked the fcuk out!" Sort of like this.

LOL! That was pretty funny. I'll give you that.
If you ever met an Albanian. You would realize that they will not feel one inch less important then you. After a while of spending time with him or her, you will realize that most Albanians feel surperior then other people or ethnicities. And they have a reason to feel that way. If Albanians felt inferior or if I felt inferior, I would not have an Albanian eagle on my chest and Albanians would not hold that flag up or talk about Albania as much as they do.
I hope that is the case. But then again, I choose not to use you as the template for all Albanians. I never said all Albanians have an inferiority complex. But you sure do.
He never agreed with you. And again, Ronnie's biggest problem with me was the KLA subject that we were talking about which you were not even in. He told me I was hyping up the KLA by saying they had 100,000 members at their height. Also, those were my JohnnyRed days am I correct. And you only recently came into the forum at that time. At that point in time. It was only Sentenza, Nickels, Razbojnik [under KCF_for_life] talking about Russia controlling the world, blacks all being ballers moving 4000 metric tonnes of cocaine in one day and Macedonian Crime lords making 12 trillion a year. It was a different time and my responses and posts did not reflect my real insights and/or thoughts and knowledge.
I guess I'll have to repost some of the statements he made when I get a chance because you seem intent on rewriting history. He had a lot of problems with you and was the first to say you are a disgrace to your own people. He was also the first to figure out you were AlbaniaUnited, though you refused to admit it for the longest time.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by CheGuevara » February 9th, 2009, 5:14 pm

I'm not trying to downsize anything. I'm going with the available facts. And there is only the Stamatis club. You are simply going by a general reference at best because it suits your argument.
Several clubs in Astoria were taken by the Rudaj gang.
I didn't say they were wrong. I said I would like to see more information about this and wonder why the attacks upon made LCN members, even if by general reference only, were not mentioned in the indictment.
Like I told you, no names or ethnicities were mentioned in the indictment except for Albanian at the top of the page.
LOL! That was pretty funny. I'll give you that.
lol.
I hope that is the case. But then again, I choose not to use you as the template for all Albanians. I never said all Albanians have an inferiority complex. But you sure do.
If I felt inferior to any people or ethnicity or anybody and felt inferior about my race I would not have marked my body for the rest of my life with an eagle right on my chest clearing stating that I am of the Albanian race. If my friend felt inferior he would not have just had his entire back tattoed with the Albanian eagle. I have another 6 friends that have that eagle tattoed on themselves. So far, I have yet to see any other nationality tattoo their flags on their chest as much as Albanians do. In fact, I have only see one movie about an American soldier who has the American flag on his shoulder. But besides that, I have never seen any other person of any nationality do so. Why do you think that is?
I guess I'll have to repost some of the statements he made when I get a chance because you seem intent on rewriting history. He had a lot of problems with you and was the first to say you are a disgrace to your own people. He was also the first to figure out you were AlbaniaUnited, though you refused to admit it for the longest time.
Like I said, different time. Different subjects and posters. Not relavent to the matter at hand right now. You can keep bringing it up if you like though. Although I just explained it for the last time.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by thewestside » February 9th, 2009, 6:41 pm

CheGuevara wrote:Several clubs in Astoria were taken by the Rudaj gang.
So says Johnny the Albanian OC fanboy. The indictment, and every other source, has listed only two - Stamatis and Soccer Fever. Two Greek clubs that were paying tribute to the Luccheses and Gambinos.
Like I told you, no names or ethnicities were mentioned in the indictment except for Albanian at the top of the page.
The accounts I've read have said that Rudaj's guys beat up the Greek operators of the clubs. Italian mob guys weren't even there when the attacks happened.
If I felt inferior to any people or ethnicity or anybody and felt inferior about my race I would not have marked my body for the rest of my life with an eagle right on my chest clearing stating that I am of the Albanian race. If my friend felt inferior he would not have just had his entire back tattoed with the Albanian eagle. I have another 6 friends that have that eagle tattoed on themselves. So far, I have yet to see any other nationality tattoo their flags on their chest as much as Albanians do. In fact, I have only see one movie about an American soldier who has the American flag on his shoulder. But besides that, I have never seen any other person of any nationality do so. Why do you think that is?
I would say you marked your body precisely because you have an inferiority complex. It's why you feel the need to brag about Albanians so much.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by CheGuevara » February 9th, 2009, 7:22 pm

So says Johnny the Albanian OC fanboy. The indictment, and every other source, has listed only two - Stamatis and Soccer Fever. Two Greek clubs that were paying tribute to the Luccheses and Gambinos.
http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/nys/pressrele ... dictpr.pdf

The RICO Indictment further alleges that the RICO
Defendants, as part of their pattern of racketeering activity, used
violence to seize control of illegal gambling in Astoria, Queens,
in or about 2001.

How many clubs they took from the LCN is debatable but they seized control of gambling in Astoria at that time. That is for sure.

http://johnsville.blogspot.com/2004/11/ ... mafia.html

Rudaj lead an attack in August 2001 on two members of the Lucchese crime family who ran a gambling racket inside a Greek social club called Soccer Fever at 26-80 30th St. in Queens, according to the indictment.
The accounts I've read have said that Rudaj's guys beat up the Greek operators of the clubs. Italian mob guys weren't even there when the attacks happened.
Go back and copy and paste where it says GREEK operators. The most I have heard was people being identified as 'victim 1', 'victim 2', etc... I never heard any nationality being mentioned.
I would say you marked your body precisely because you have an inferiority complex. It's why you feel the need to brag about Albanians so much.
Sure. You have an answer for absolutely everything. I am proud of you.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by thewestside » February 9th, 2009, 9:19 pm

CheGuevara wrote:
http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/nys/pressrele ... dictpr.pdf

The RICO Indictment further alleges that the RICO
Defendants, as part of their pattern of racketeering activity, used
violence to seize control of illegal gambling in Astoria, Queens,
in or about 2001.

How many clubs they took from the LCN is debatable but they seized control of gambling in Astoria at that time. That is for sure.
You are completely misreading this. Or rather, reading into it what you want to. Yes, Rudaj took over gambling in Astoria - the Stamatis and Soccer Fever clubs. But those two clubs alone were not the extent of all the illegal gambling that goes on in the area. Those are the only ones that have been mentioned with respect to the LCN, so it's certainly not debatable if they took over any more. But you like to think they could have.
http://johnsville.blogspot.com/2004/11/ ... mafia.html

Rudaj lead an attack in August 2001 on two members of the Lucchese crime family who ran a gambling racket inside a Greek social club called Soccer Fever at 26-80 30th St. in Queens, according to the indictment.
Go back and copy and paste where it says GREEK operators. The most I have heard was people being identified as 'victim 1', 'victim 2', etc... I never heard any nationality being mentioned.
I've read about this specific account. They were not made members of the Lucchese family. They weren't even Italian associates. They were Greek operators of the club. Why is this so hard for you to understand? These were not LCN clubs per se. The Greeks have ran much of the illegal gambling directly in Astoria for years (because there is a significant Greek population there) but have had to pay a tax to the LCN to operate. These were Greek gambling clubs. Not LCN ones. Stamatis and Soccer Fever were Greek clubs run by Greeks who simply paid the Luccheses and Gambinos to operate. Even the source that inaccurately mentions "two Lucchese members" being attacked says that Soccer Fever was a Greek gambling club. As was Stamatis. And that's the primary reason why Rudaj went after them.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by CheGuevara » February 10th, 2009, 11:41 am

You are completely misreading this. Or rather, reading into it what you want to. Yes, Rudaj took over gambling in Astoria - the Stamatis and Soccer Fever clubs. But those two clubs alone were not the extent of all the illegal gambling that goes on in the area. Those are the only ones that have been mentioned with respect to the LCN, so it's certainly not debatable if they took over any more. But you like to think they could have.
The report said they seized control of illegal gambling in Astoria!!!!! Are you a MORON!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! If they only took over some LCN controlled clubs the sentence would have said, "they seized gambling OPERATIONS in Astoria". Get real. Rudaj took over or collected tax from more Astoria club then just those two.
I've read about this specific account. They were not made members of the Lucchese family. They weren't even Italian associates. They were Greek operators of the club. Why is this so hard for you to understand? These were not LCN clubs per se. The Greeks have ran much of the illegal gambling directly in Astoria for years (because there is a significant Greek population there) but have had to pay a tax to the LCN to operate. These were Greek gambling clubs. Not LCN ones. Stamatis and Soccer Fever were Greek clubs run by Greeks who simply paid the Luccheses and Gambinos to operate. Even the source that inaccurately mentions "two Lucchese members" being attacked says that Soccer Fever was a Greek gambling club. As was Stamatis. And that's the primary reason why Rudaj went after them.

Okay so this source is wrong and the FBI is wrong. Nice you know you are fully functional.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by thewestside » February 10th, 2009, 3:24 pm

CheGuevara wrote:The report said they seized control of illegal gambling in Astoria!!!!! Are you a MORON!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! If they only took over some LCN controlled clubs the sentence would have said, "they seized gambling OPERATIONS in Astoria". Get real. Rudaj took over or collected tax from more Astoria club then just those two.
Just another example of you reading what you want into something. The illegal gambling in Astoria went beyond Stamatis and Soccer Fever. If the Rudaj group took over more clubs than those two, which ones were they? Why weren't they mentioned in the indictment? Once again, you are not going off demonstrable fact, just your own assumptions.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by CheGuevara » February 10th, 2009, 7:14 pm

Just another example of you reading what you want into something. The illegal gambling in Astoria went beyond Stamatis and Soccer Fever. If the Rudaj group took over more clubs than those two, which ones were they? Why weren't they mentioned in the indictment? Once again, you are not going off demonstrable fact, just your own assumptions.
No clubs were mentioned by name in the indictment. Except for soccer fever because they were talking about the charges for the attack they lead in Soccer Fever. Not a single club other then that was mentioned in the indictment. The indictment said they seized control of illegal gambling in Astoria. If they meant they simply took over two clubs. They would have said they seized control of gambling operations in Astoria. The fact that they said, ''control of gambling in Astoria'' means that they are talking about it all. It is just hard for you to admit because you wish to downsize Rudaj as much as possible. Saying they make a mere $4,000,000 when that was just the count for the gambling machines they had. They also controlled clubs in the Bronx, Westchester and Mount Vernon as well as in Port something. You're neverending BS never ceases to stop.



RUDAJ BEAT THE FCUK OUT OF MADE MEN
RUDAJ TOOK CONTROL OF ASTORIA GAMBLING!
GET THE FCUK OVER IT AND MOVE ON WITH YOU'RE LIFE!

“We had a sense they were an organization, but we were surprised at how aggressively they challenged New York’s Italian organized crime families,” said the FBI case agent assigned to the investigation. “They started taking territory, beating up ‘made men.’

The RICO Indictment further alleges that the RICO
Defendants, as part of their pattern of racketeering activity, used
violence to seize control of illegal gambling in Astoria, Queens,
in or about 2001.


http://www.fbi.gov/page2/march06/albanian032906.htm
http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/nys/pressrele ... dictpr.pdf

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by thewestside » February 10th, 2009, 7:25 pm

"Seizing control of illegal gambling" in Astoria doesn't necessarily mean taking over all illegal gambling. But like I said, you're only too happy to assume it does. I prefer to go with what is the evidence at hand - two Greek clubs. That's it. If there were any others, they would be mentioned in the indictment, articles, and other sources. But they aren't. Why? Most likely because there were none.

"They started staking territory, beating up 'made men.'" Once again, who? Which made men? Why haven't their names been said anywhere? Everything else the Rudaj gang did was latched onto by the press, who in turn hyped it up. Beating up made Mafia members would be major news. But all I've seen are accounts of them beating up Greek operators. But once again, you're happy to just go by assumption as long as it suits Albanians.

This is simply another example of how you try to get as much mileage out of the Rudaj gang as you can because it's the only example you have of any Albanians in the U.S. taking on the Mafia. I'm sure you have spent hours and hours searching the internet trying to come up with other examples but you obviously couldn't because they're are none. The Albanians are not going to "push aside" the Italian Mafia. You know it and I know it. They are not going to become the "new kingpins of crime." You know it and I know it. You keep trying to add to your list of Albanian OC in the U.S. but it's still relatively small. Yes, the Albanians are an emerging group here, in Canada, and other places. But they aren't at the level you wish they were and probably never will be.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by CheGuevara » February 10th, 2009, 8:23 pm

First of all, Only Soccer fever was mentioned in the indictment by name. Not a single club other then that was mentioned by name. You are just making it up saying why were only TWO mentioned. Only Soccer Fever was mentioned.

No body was name by ethnicity or name getting beat up in the indictment. Go find it if there is because you keep mentioning it. Made men were beat up you moron. Get over it. Why would the FBI lie on their own website?

Again you are reading into it what YOU want to. Not what I want to. The words seized control of gambling in Astoria would not have been stated if they didnt seize control of gambling there.

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Re: Suge Knight and Sonny Franzese

Unread post by CheGuevara » February 10th, 2009, 8:27 pm

The Rudaj Organization then opened or began collecting protection payments from at least six Astoria, Queens gambling clubs including:

• Athenia on Newtown Avenue

• The Saloni Social Club on 30th Avenue

• And Sanidisi on 31st Street

• Skutarija on 23rd Avenue

• An unidentified club on 30th Avenue

• Zeus on 23rd Avenue


Including the two they took over from the LCN. I think I would be correct to read into the indictment EXACTLY WHAT THE FCUK IT SAYS.

I hope everyone reads this and realizes you are a piece of shit FRAUD. And a down right liar.

http://johnsville.blogspot.com/2004/11/ ... mafia.html

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