Trip on this shit...

Unread post by **AcmeWhiteBread** » February 3rd, 2006, 3:18 am

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060202/ap_ ... ion_ritual

none for you · Unread post by **none for you** » February 6th, 2006, 1:01 am

if the Jews are so efffin smart, why cant they accept the fact that God (God = a blanket title, please!) made man perfectly?

Mutilating infants is WRONG!!!! To take a baby boy, and cut away at one of his most sensitive areas is asking for trouble....

I wonder how it must effect the minds of men..... a very traumatic subconscious facet of way too many men...

I'll say it again,
MUTILATING INFANTS IS WRONG!!!!!

If God wanted us to rearrange our body parts, God would have sent us in disassembled.

Unread post by **Godfather** » February 6th, 2006, 5:30 pm

88reasonswhy wrote:if the Jews are so efffin smart, why cant they accept the fact that God (God = a blanket title, please!) made man perfectly?

Mutilating infants is WRONG!!!! To take a baby boy, and cut away at one of his most sensitive areas is asking for trouble....

I wonder how it must effect the minds of men..... a very traumatic subconscious facet of way too many men...

I'll say it again,
MUTILATING INFANTS IS WRONG!!!!!

If God wanted us to rearrange our body parts, God would have sent us in disassembled.

And if god dosn't exist, everything you mentioned makes no sense. What do you mean god makes everything perfectly? How do you explain children with downs syndrom, children who are born with birth defects, any of that stuff? I guess your god dosn't know what he's doing, huh?

none for you · Unread post by **none for you** » February 6th, 2006, 7:53 pm

Godfather wrote:
88reasonswhy wrote:if the Jews are so efffin smart, why cant they accept the fact that God (God = a blanket title, please!) made man perfectly?

Mutilating infants is WRONG!!!! To take a baby boy, and cut away at one of his most sensitive areas is asking for trouble....

I wonder how it must effect the minds of men..... a very traumatic subconscious facet of way too many men...

I'll say it again,
MUTILATING INFANTS IS WRONG!!!!!

If God wanted us to rearrange our body parts, God would have sent us in disassembled.

And if god dosn't exist, everything you mentioned makes no sense. What do you mean god makes everything perfectly? How do you explain children with downs syndrom, children who are born with birth defects, any of that stuff? I guess your god dosn't know what he's doing, huh?

ok F**K the God issue./... so you can stop measuring my oranges to your apples....
what about snipping a baby boy's penis off for the sake of religious beliefs? WHICH IS THE POINT! and then.. lets face it.... what is the rabbi doing ?? really// the whole thing is beyond disgusting.....

Once again, God and religion proves to be mutually exclusive

Unread post by **Godfather** » February 6th, 2006, 10:16 pm

88reasonswhy wrote:if the Jews are so efffin smart, why cant they accept the fact that God (God = a blanket title, please!) made man perfectly?
Mutilating infants is WRONG!!!! To take a baby boy, and cut away at one of his most sensitive areas is asking for trouble....

I wonder how it must effect the minds of men..... a very traumatic subconscious facet of way too many men...

I'll say it again,
MUTILATING INFANTS IS WRONG!!!!!

If God wanted us to rearrange our body parts, God would have sent us in disassembled.

You brought god up not me. I just pointed out how god in no way creates anyone perfectly.

none for you · Unread post by **none for you** » February 6th, 2006, 10:40 pm

Godfather wrote:You brought god up not me. I just pointed out how god in no way creates anyone perfectly.

your ideal being of perfection is NOT what perfection in Nature is....

but then I HAVE to think you are evading the topic because you are privately disgraced by the circumcision that was forced upon you as an infant.....
hmmm?

MiChuhSuh · Unread post by **MiChuhSuh** » February 11th, 2006, 7:28 pm

^ Okay do you realize that argument makes no sense?

That's like saying "why cut teh umbelical chord, that is mutilation of babies and people are perfect so just leave it there, leave the baby attached to the mom"

LOL keeping logical sense next time

P.S. circumsicion helps keeps the genitals from infection and teh VERY painful possibility that the foreskins will end up tearing later on, not a good situation to have in the middle of sex

MiChuhSuh · Unread post by **MiChuhSuh** » February 11th, 2006, 7:33 pm

88reasonswhy wrote:if the Jews are so efffin smart, why cant they accept the fact that God (God = a blanket title, please!) made man perfectly?

Mutilating infants is WRONG!!!! To take a baby boy, and cut away at one of his most sensitive areas is asking for trouble....

I wonder how it must effect the minds of men..... a very traumatic subconscious facet of way too many men...

I'll say it again,
MUTILATING INFANTS IS WRONG!!!!!

If God wanted us to rearrange our body parts, God would have sent us in disassembled.

byt the way I was referring to this post

none for you · Unread post by **none for you** » February 11th, 2006, 11:46 pm

End Violence NOW wrote:^ Okay do you realize that argument makes no sense?

well thats because you think an apple is an orange:

End Violence NOW wrote: That's like saying "why cut teh umbelical chord, that is mutilation of babies and people are perfect so just leave it there, leave the baby attached to the mom"

hardly ..... circumcision is as far away from umbilical chord cutting as a nose job is to an appendectomy.

End Violence NOW wrote:
LOL keeping logical sense next time

likewise!!!

End Violence NOW wrote:
P.S. circumsicion helps keeps the genitals from infection and teh VERY painful possibility that the foreskins will end up tearing later on, not a good situation to have in the middle of sex

ok... now the infection thing is due to lazy, squeemish or ignorant mothers refusing to teach their sons to properly clean themselves ( probably because they cant bring themselves to touch their boys for health reasons for fear of sexual deviations)

as for a foreskin tearing.. well !!! that's a new one on me! I am gonna go look that up and see if thsts ever even been a medical issue....

MiChuhSuh · Unread post by **MiChuhSuh** » February 12th, 2006, 5:50 pm

It's rare, but I heard about it in the news, so why even take a risk?

As for infection, why not circumcise to make it easier? You can't deny it does help, you just said yourself it has to be even more carefully cleaned if it's not circumcised, but just taking a shower is usually good enough for those circumsized

And it's not just a Jewish thing, they were just teh first to do it, it's medically benificial? It really has no negative side to it, especially if done in a hospital.

The only thing I can think of is if something crazy happens like in "Meet the Fockers" LOL if you saw that movie

But that goes for any medical procedure

none for you · Unread post by **none for you** » February 12th, 2006, 7:56 pm

End Violence NOW wrote: It's rare, but I heard about it in the news, so why even take a risk?

nuh -uh:) not gonna buy it

End Violence NOW wrote: .... it's medically benificial? It really has no negative side to it, ...

.
I COMPLETELY disagree... It traumatizes infants and dont you even try and tell me it doesnt.. not a one hasnt screamed his head off from it....

I think it should be a personal choice...

the Jews made it a part of their religion, soI can go so far as to say it as unsanctomonious as infant baptizing.... if one should want tobe baptized (or circumizied) one should do it with conscious awareness... as spirituality and knowing God does not come from ritual but from spiritual connectedness.

it goes right along with forced clitorectomies (another mutilation of infant's genitals) ..... and why is it such a wrong thing in one culture and nation and not in another.... ?

a bunch of twisted moralists if you ask me... control control control

If I ever had a son, he would not have been cut at birth... that's for damned sure.

MiChuhSuh · Unread post by **MiChuhSuh** » February 13th, 2006, 12:12 pm

88reasonswhy wrote:I COMPLETELY disagree... It traumatizes infants and dont you even try and tell me it doesnt.. not a one hasnt screamed his head off from it....

Infant's don't even have the parts of teh brain that form memory until later, so how does it, how COULD it traumatize them when they have no memory cells working yet?

a bunch of twisted moralists if you ask me... control control control

uh... no. It's more MEDICAL at this point, because
1. By population, more non-Jews do thsi than Jews at this point in time
2. Most "Jews" are not "Jewish" at this point, they may say they are within "Judaism" but more so out of a feeling of obligation than actually following Judaism, sort of like how many people who say they are "Christian" are in basically no way "Christian"

And so far there were only about couple confirmed cases I could find but I'm sure there's more, this iwas just from a medical journal, I'll post it up later

Oh, and you didn't mention/respond to the fact it prevents infections.

none for you · Unread post by **none for you** » February 13th, 2006, 7:09 pm

End Violence NOW wrote:
88reasonswhy wrote:I COMPLETELY disagree... It traumatizes infants and dont you even try and tell me it doesnt.. not a one hasnt screamed his head off from it....
Infant's don't even have the parts of teh brain that form memory until later, so how does it, how COULD it traumatize them when they have no memory cells working yet?

nice theory .. but i dont buy it.... we are lied to about everything from early on.... most of my earliest childhood memories are obeing told "quit it" shut up" "it doesnt hurt"... so.... as for perosnal experience, i know i learned to stuff feelings long before i could identify them. Thanks mom!
Birth is truamatic.. it is why wedont rmember it.. a lotof people who have been severely traumatized dont remember it... the brain is good at disguising severe trauma.. but hte body remember. the body rmembers everything and it wont let the brain completely forget,,, and the repressed trauma does come out in latent behavior later on down the road.

a bunch of twisted moralists if you ask me... control control control

uh... no. It's more MEDICAL at this point, because
1. By population, more non-Jews do thsi than Jews at this point in time
2. Most "Jews" are not "Jewish" at this point, they may say they are within "Judaism" but more so out of a feeling of obligation than actually following Judaism, sort of like how many people who say they are "Christian" are in basically no way "Christian"

And so far there were only about couple confirmed cases I could find but I'm sure there's more, this iwas just from a medical journal, I'll post it up later

Oh, and you didn't mention/respond to the fact it prevents infections.[/quote]

the foreskin is no more a place of germs than say the labia. you dont hear of labia removal for the convenience of lazy bathers, do you?
if it became a serious problem later on. then I would say an individual could elect to have that sort of "fix" ...

the article was in reference of an infant dying due to herpes transmitted by the rabbi who put the baby's penis IN HIS MOUTH! for "religious" purposes/// I AM NOT OK WITH THIS. SO your medical argument is really out of context/

MiChuhSuh · Unread post by **MiChuhSuh** » February 14th, 2006, 9:23 am

88reasonswhy wrote:nice theory .. but i dont buy it.... we are lied to about everything from early on.... most of my earliest childhood memories are obeing told "quit it" shut up" "it doesnt hurt"... so.... as for perosnal experience, i know i learned to stuff feelings long before i could identify them. Thanks mom!
Birth is truamatic.. it is why wedont rmember it.. a lotof people who have been severely traumatized dont remember it... the brain is good at disguising severe trauma.. but hte body remember. the body rmembers everything and it wont let the brain completely forget,,, and the repressed trauma does come out in latent behavior later on down the road.

My first memory was my mom stabbing me when I was 2, and medically they say real memory doesn't occur until 4, or at earliest 3, so I guess it could happen earlier, but at birth?

You just said yourself, "birth is traumatic," so is birth wrong? And if not, then if circumcision is made as a part of the "birth" process, it is only included in this birth which will not be remembered. And you're right, if birth could be rememberd it would have been traumatic, which is exactly why memory doesn't really function until after. It's not a theory, it's science, atheistical, secular science even.

Most people who say they remember things like birth, and who honesty believe and feel they do, really don't. They are subconsciously collecting information about birth when they see birth, see videos and/or other information about birht, and think (whether consciously or not) about birth and what it's like or what they it was like. Later on they remember this thought/these thoughts and think it's a memory of the actual thing, and not of their previous thoughts, and think they can remember birth.

I think I read somewhere you are into some Daoism and things of that nature? Then you yourself already know how complex and tricky thought, memory, perception, and unintentional deception/self-deception can be.

the article was in reference of an infant dying due to herpes transmitted by the rabbi who put the baby's penis IN HIS MOUTH! for "religious" purposes/// I AM NOT OK WITH THIS. SO your medical argument is really out of context/

????????????????????????????????
This is deeply disturbing...... wtf.... SICK
Do you have a link to teh story or something? I have never heard anything like that

But I think you don't understand the difference between 3 things

1. The concept/idea/religion/belief
2. The person "trying" to follow it
3. The person who claims to follow it but doesn't "try."

All three are very different.

none for you · Unread post by **none for you** » February 14th, 2006, 8:00 pm

End Violence NOW wrote:
????????????????????????????????
This is deeply disturbing...... wtf.... SICK
Do you have a link to teh story or something? I have never heard anything like that

But I think you don't understand the difference between 3 things

1. The concept/idea/religion/belief
2. The person "trying" to follow it
3. The person who claims to follow it but doesn't "try."

All three are very different.

hello??? the link at the top of this thread????? did you not read it?

and yes.. I know the difference between those three things... I am not your average lame.

I have no use for heretics and "sheep".

Unread post by **TarHeelRED** » February 14th, 2006, 9:35 pm

End Violence NOW wrote:
88reasonswhy wrote:I COMPLETELY disagree... It traumatizes infants and dont you even try and tell me it doesnt.. not a one hasnt screamed his head off from it....

Infant's don't even have the parts of teh brain that form memory until later, so how does it, how COULD it traumatize them when they have no memory cells working yet?

AMEN End Violence Now!!!!!!! 1's scope won't even suffer the memory 2 relapse so far in the past. If you're not speaking and inferring according 2 facts u need 2 shut up!!!!!

Unread post by **TarHeelRED** » February 14th, 2006, 9:53 pm

End Violence Now, the vast and uttermost majority of 88reasonswhy's ignorance is imputted 2 his incompetence of the Bible and Jesus. Don't let science be your creditation 2 Hades, 88reasonswhy.
Psalms 2:2-3:The kings of the earth set themselves,and the rulers take counsel together, against the LORD, and against his anointed, saying, Let us break their bands asunder, and cast away their cords from us.

none for you · Unread post by **none for you** » February 18th, 2006, 11:09 pm

TarHeelRED wrote:End Violence Now, the vast and uttermost majority of 88reasonswhy's ignorance is imputted 2 his incompetence of the Bible and Jesus. Don't let science be your creditation 2 Hades, 88reasonswhy.
Psalms 2:2-3:The kings of the earth set themselves,and the rulers take counsel together, against the LORD, and against his anointed, saying, Let us break their bands asunder, and cast away their cords from us.

you know, tarheelRED, it is perfectly okay to not have a single thought in your head, but the scripture recitals dont make up for lack of intelligence and a personality...
western science is NOT the only option to Christianity...
how narrow minded of you all...

if the memory isnt formed before whatever you seem to think....
how is it babies can have nightmares?

I guess there is little to be explained to the minds of MEN/

Unread post by **TarHeelRED** » February 19th, 2006, 12:58 am

So you're also chauvinistic in addition 2 your heathenism. Well u do know it is a Man's world don't u?
Hint: He's got the whole world in HIS hands.
He's got the whole world in HIS hands.
He's got the whole world in HIS hands.
He's got the whole world in HIS hands.
Ever heard that song? Just a little more of my citations. I'd rather cite and speak godly than speak dogmatically and scottishly.

Unread post by **AcmeWhiteBread** » February 19th, 2006, 7:10 am

Its child abuse pure and simple.

none for you · Unread post by **none for you** » February 19th, 2006, 11:23 pm

AcmeWhiteBread wrote:Its child abuse pure and simple.

I agreee.... I am guessing you agree with me a little?.... cuz this whole thing has had me backed into a corner, what with small minds not reading the article and having big opinions and all...

none for you · Unread post by **none for you** » February 19th, 2006, 11:32 pm

TarHeelRED wrote:So you're also chauvinistic in addition 2 your heathenism. Well u do know it is a Man's world don't u?
Hint: He's got the whole world in HIS hands.
He's got the whole world in HIS hands.
He's got the whole world in HIS hands.
He's got the whole world in HIS hands.
Ever heard that song? Just a little more of my citations. I'd rather cite and speak godly than speak dogmatically and scottishly.

WTF??? the ONLY thing you say is DOGMA!

You wouldnt know God if SHE/HE/IT smacked you upside the head with the TRUTH!

here. THIS is some spiritual wisdom that makes a LOT more sense than the stuff you use instead of your own ideas...
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
When the world follows the Tao,
Even fast horses are used to fertilize the fields.

When the world rejects the Tao,
Farmland is used to breed warhorses.

No disaster is worse than being discontented.
No omen (for your future) worse than being greedy.
Yet, if you can find (true) contentment, it will last forever.

none for you · Unread post by **none for you** » February 19th, 2006, 11:36 pm

this one is MUCH more appropriate:

When alive, the body is supple, yielding.
In death, the body becomes hard, unyielding.

Living plants are flexible,
In death, they become dry and brittle.

Therefore, stubborn people are disciples of death, but
Flexible people are disciples of life.

In the same way,
Inflexible soldiers cannot win (a victory).
And the hardest trees are readiest for an axe to chop them down
Tough guys sink to the bottom, while
Flexible people rise to the top.

Unread post by **perongregory** » February 19th, 2006, 11:48 pm

Circumsicion is good ( for health reasons)...now putting your mouth on a baby boy's penis is some sick ass twisted shit. That Rabbi is prob. a peder ass.

what do you anti-circumsicion people feel about removing your wisdom teeth, since God made us perfect, etc.?

none for you · Unread post by **none for you** » February 20th, 2006, 12:06 am

perongregory wrote:Circumsicion is good ( for health reasons)...now putting your mouth on a baby boy's penis is some sick ass twisted shit. That Rabbi is prob. a peder ass.

what do you anti-circumsicion people feel about removing your wisdom teeth, since God made us perfect, etc.?

I had mine removed at the age of 30 because they were riddled with cavities...not at 18 because it was the "right thing" to do.
I was made perfect, but Playboy, Vogue and Cosmopolitan magazines says I am far less than perfect.
I have all the rest of my teeth .. unlike a lot of people I know.

regardless of what humans think perfection is... we all die.
So the perfect plan includes death and decay.

none for you · Unread post by **none for you** » February 20th, 2006, 12:11 am

TarHeelRED wrote:So you're also chauvinistic in addition 2 your heathenism. Well u do know it is a Man's world don't u?
....

1.
chauvanist? really? pretty good trick FOR A GIRL!
2.
what exactly makes me a heathen? (as if it werea bad thing.. like calling me a BITCH!!!)
3.
it's a man's world? WHO told you THAT?.. .if it's a man's world, then at least I know who to blame for this gawdawful mess!

Unread post by **TarHeelRED** » February 22nd, 2006, 12:36 am

88reasonswhy wrote:
TarHeelRED wrote:So you're also chauvinistic in addition 2 your heathenism. Well u do know it is a Man's world don't u?
....

1.
chauvanist? really? pretty good trick FOR A GIRL!
2.
what exactly makes me a heathen? (as if it werea bad thing.. like calling me a BITCH!!!)
3.
it's a man's world? WHO told you THAT?.. .if it's a man's world, then at least I know who to blame for this gawdawful mess!

If you're not a dame I apologize. Girl? Me? Negative, I had my foreskin ablated at birth!! What makes u a heathen, I have previously expounded why u are a heathen. I will not tread on that track again. It's a man's world because Jesus wrought it.
Colossians 1:16-17: For by Him(Jesus) were ALL things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: ALL THINGS WERE CREATED BY HIM AND FOR HIM: AND HE IS BEFORE ALL THINGS, AND BY HIM ALL THINGS CONSIST.

none for you · Unread post by **none for you** » February 23rd, 2006, 11:41 pm

TarHeelRED wrote:
88reasonswhy wrote:
TarHeelRED wrote:So you're also chauvinistic in addition 2 your heathenism. Well u do know it is a Man's world don't u?
....

1.
chauvanist? really? pretty good trick FOR A GIRL!
2.
what exactly makes me a heathen? (as if it werea bad thing.. like calling me a BITCH!!!)
3.
it's a man's world? WHO told you THAT?.. .if it's a man's world, then at least I know who to blame for this gawdawful mess!
If you're not a dame I apologize. Girl? Me? Negative, I had my foreskin ablated at birth!! What makes u a heathen, I have previously expounded why u are a heathen. I will not tread on that track again. It's a man's world because Jesus wrought it.
Colossians 1:16-17: For by Him(Jesus) were ALL things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: ALL THINGS WERE CREATED BY HIM AND FOR HIM: AND HE IS BEFORE ALL THINGS, AND BY HIM ALL THINGS CONSIST.

so... once again I am addressed by you with a repartee of the only book you have ever read.

It may be man's world to you... but to me, I see it from a whole other perspective... I can either do it the way it is suggested by whomever wants dominion over me, or I can do it MY WAY!

Unread post by **EmperorPenguin** » February 28th, 2006, 1:05 am

perongregory wrote:Circumsicion is good ( for health reasons)...now putting your mouth on a baby boy's penis is some sick ass twisted shit. That Rabbi is prob. a peder ass.

what do you anti-circumsicion people feel about removing your wisdom teeth, since God made us perfect, etc.?

It's only good for health reasons in that it's easier for a person to keep their penis clean when there's no foreskin, that's not to say someone with a foreskin can't keep themselves just as clean, it just requires a bit more time and effort. Circumsions tend to make the nerve endings less receptive in the head of the penis, so in that sense it's better to NOT be cirumsized. On another note, if circumisions are done wrong, the infant can actually bleed to death. I don't remember the last time I heard about a person dying from a pulled tooth.

Having recently had a child (a girl) I at one point had to make the decision that if it had been a boy would we get it circumsized or not. Myself having been, I still wouldn't put my child thru something like that for no reason. If it's someones religion to have it done (and yes, some rabbis place their mouths on the penis head to suck the blood, this has also lead to diseases having been spread to the child) then that's something that's very hard to argue against.

none for you · Unread post by **none for you** » February 28th, 2006, 10:42 pm

EmperorPenguin wrote:
perongregory wrote:Circumsicion is good ( for health reasons)...now putting your mouth on a baby boy's penis is some sick ass twisted shit. That Rabbi is prob. a peder ass.

what do you anti-circumsicion people feel about removing your wisdom teeth, since God made us perfect, etc.?
It's only good for health reasons in that it's easier for a person to keep their penis clean when there's no foreskin, that's not to say someone with a foreskin can't keep themselves just as clean, it just requires a bit more time and effort. Circumsions tend to make the nerve endings less receptive in the head of the penis, so in that sense it's better to NOT be cirumsized. On another note, if circumisions are done wrong, the infant can actually bleed to death. I don't remember the last time I heard about a person dying from a pulled tooth.

Having recently had a child (a girl) I at one point had to make the decision that if it had been a boy would we get it circumsized or not. Myself having been, I still wouldn't put my child thru something like that for no reason. If it's someones religion to have it done (and yes, some rabbis place their mouths on the penis head to suck the blood, this has also lead to diseases having been spread to the child) then that's something that's very hard to argue against.

thank you!!! oh and I would like to bring up at this time of a documentary I saw of a pair of Canadian twin boys who, when they were circumsiced at infancy, they botched one and decided because his penis was so mutilated to give him a sex change... well unfortunately this boy was 110% male and had a miserable upbringing as the girl he wasnt.

It was a terrible thing,but really reflects on how the medical industry at the time (early 60s?) was more concerned about adjusting this person's self image by his genitalia than his whole person.
pretty sad if you ask me...

Unread post by **perongregory** » March 1st, 2006, 12:04 am

circumsicion all the way.

Unread post by **EmperorPenguin** » March 1st, 2006, 2:28 am

perongregory wrote:circumsicion all the way.

Again, I got 'cut' when I was a baby, and I personally don't have a problem with that. If it's a religious thing, then fine, so be it. Though you have to understand that your child might grow up and resent the fact that you A: did this, and B: forced your religious beliefs on them and put them at risk. Most parents raise their children with their own beliefs, but there's no reason to put them at physical risk when the procedure can be done when they're older and can decide this for themselves... at an extremely painful price.

As far as medically goes, there's no proof it provides any substantial benefit. At least up in Canada it's not even covered by Health Care anymore, it's classified as 'cosmetic surgery'. So if you're so inclined to get it done for "God" so be it. There are safer, cleaner ways to go about it. Rabbi's putting their mouthes on babies penises is not the right way. It's a rare procedure that most Rabbi's don't do, but one in peticular is being accused of infecting up to 4 babies (leading to atleast 1 death) with herpes. Wow, I bet "God" is just ecstatic about that.