Only True Gang Prevention

[AllhoodPublications]

I've said a million times....


.... is to give these kids normal paying jobs, not a job at poverty level. If you were convicted of a Felony or don't have a High School education, it shouldn't matter if you can do the job just as effectively as someone who hasn't.

You shouldn't be rewarded for graduating from High School without a jail record, you should be rewarded on which field you chose to work in and how effective you are at doing what you do.

To stop gangs... we need more Government Funded Programs, Gyms, Computers, Higher Salaries, better reading materials in Schools and Programs... and stop the import of Cocaine, X, Heroin etc... Gangsters in America don't make that stuff.. we just go to jail for that stuff.

[Sentenza]

and stop the import of Cocaine, X, Heroin etc... Gangsters in America don't make that stuff.. we just go to jail for that stuff.

But how do you want to accomplish that? As long as there is a market that stuff will come in. Capitalism at its best in a sense.
The US spent billions to fight the cultivation of Cocaine and to hunt down different drug-lords in SA. Yet i t didnt change anything at all. Pablo Escobar is dead, now someone else does the same job.

[Sentenza]

But basically i agree with you.

[kay]

My Mom has always thought legalizing drugs would stop the criminal activity associated with them.
Up here the media says that pot alone is a multi-billion dollar industry, I can't explain why a government wouldn't want in on that?

[Sentenza]

Fake moral issues. I say fake cause in other instances the US cooperates with Drug-Lords.

[kay]

I agree with you.

[shaun_zach]

I can't totally agree with the job aspect. Gettin an education is important especially with the evolution and advancement in the job market. I'm not saying that people without a high school diploma or criminal background be given piss poor jobs but they are not on the same educational and disciplinary level as someone with a high school diploma or college degree and no record. What you are saying is that it is ok to drop out of school and you will be rewarded with a good paying job, but you haven't acquired the neccessary skills and discipline it takes to do the job. What kind of message are you sending to these kids by saying this. Give them an alternative to getting a high school diploma, like technicle school, trade school, even job corp. Because either way you look at it, you still have to be disciplined.

[StillNoScript]

Shaun zach, that's true. The job market is changing from the industrial age to the digital age, and a lot of jobs simply aren't going to be there anymore. But, what can be done is the government could train adults without an education, who want to compete in that market.

Unfortunately, long gone are the days of working at a place for 30 years at $20/hr, full medical and dental, and a pension, without having skills that can't be replaced by cheap labor. But it doesn't mean that government can't help. That's the b.s. that the current leaders are trying to feed us, that it's entirely on us. You sink or swim. That's how THEY want it.

The government can tax the rich and put it toward vocational education for not only adults, but also for teens and young adults that have been screwed by poverty, bad parenting, poor schools, or all of the above.

[Common Sense]

I've said a million times....

.... is to give these kids normal paying jobs, not a job at poverty level..

Kids should be in school, not at work.

If you were convicted of a Felony or don't have a High School education, it shouldn't matter if you can do the job just as effectively as someone who hasn't.

Number one, don't get a felony. We all have to make choices in life, and this is not one of them. True...a good worker is a good worker.

You shouldn't be rewarded for graduating from High School without a jail record, you should be rewarded on which field you chose to work in and how effective you are at doing what you do.

Graduating from high school is a reward for years of hard work. Jail has nothing to do with it. Jail is in it's own separate category of crime and punishment.

To stop gangs... we need more Government Funded Programs, Gyms, Computers, Higher Salaries, better reading materials in Schools and Programs... and stop the import of Cocaine, X, Heroin etc... Gangsters in America don't make that stuff.. we just go to jail for that stuff.

Being in the exclusive club of gangsters alone, will increase thy chances of going to jail. It's all about choice.

[rocstar]

]To stop gangs... we need more Government Funded Programs, Gyms, Computers, Higher Salaries, better reading materials in Schools and Programs... and stop the import of Cocaine, X, Heroin etc... Gangsters in America don't make that stuff.. we just go to jail for that stuff.

Being in the exclusive club of gangsters alone, will increase thy chances of going to jail. It's all about choice.

Saying it's simply about choice is a cop out. If we put all the responsibility on children not to make a mistake we should have no age specific laws. They should drink, smoke and do whatever at any age they want to. If we don't provide a REALISTIC option for troubled youth there will ALWAYS be a large group that falls through the cracks. Children in nicer areas/middle class and above make just as many or more mistakes as children in urban/crime ridden areas the only difference is the severity of the crime which is comparable to the difference in living between the two. And like KevMac said, once you commit that first felony society makes it hard to get out of the cycle.

Bush and his government want to make Iraq into a democratic state because they believe that if they knock off the terrorist who are actively at war with America now, there will be a new ideology for the children coming up. When it comes to the minority and poor white youth in America no one want's to work on the problem to help the youth that have yet to be caught in the cycle, they would just rather say it's your choice.

[StillNoScript]

Saying it's simply about choice is a cop out. If we put all the responsibility on children not to make a mistake we should have no age specific laws. They should drink, smoke and do whatever at any age they want to. If we don't provide a REALISTIC option for troubled youth there will ALWAYS be a large group that falls through the cracks. Children in nicer areas/middle class and above make just as many or more mistakes as children in urban/crime ridden areas the only difference is the severity of the crime which is comparable to the difference in living between the two. And like KevMac said, once you commit that first felony society makes it hard to get out of the cycle.

Bush and his government want to make Iraq into a democratic state because they believe that if they knock off the terrorist who are actively at war with America now, there will be a new ideology for the children coming up. When it comes to the minority and poor white youth in America no one want's to work on the problem to help the youth that have yet to be caught in the cycle, they would just rather say it's your choice.

You've got the right idea, rocstar. It's just that there's a huge media/marketing machine out there designed to make it too easy for the status quo to live in denial of everything that you just said.

As they say; 'If it's not on CNN, it didn't happen'.

[StillNoScript]

Nonetheless, great post, Rocstar. You nailed it.

[rocstar]

[ It's just that there's a huge media/marketing machine out there designed to make it too easy for the status quo to live in denial of everything that you just said.
As they say; 'If it's not on CNN, it didn't happen'.

Exactly. Most people can't understand why anyone would commit a crime in America because they can't comprehend the way some people live. There are thirld world elements to our society that is totally ignored. Thats why celebrities go overseas to adopt children like homelessness isnt a serious situation in our country for our youth.

If you notice though they are always trying to come up with prevention programs and ideas about these little white kids shooting up schools. They not worried about just arresting the shooters, they also want to find a way to prevent other children from committing the same crimes. They just arrest us and do nothing to stifle the cycle.

[Common Sense]

Saying it's simply about choice is a cop out.

Everything about life is a choice, and that's real.

If we put all the responsibility on children not to make a mistake we should have no age specific laws. They should drink, smoke and do whatever at any age they want to.

All the responsibility is not on the child. Parents/guardians/caregivers all share in responsibility. Unfortunately some of these responsible people are irresponsible for their own lives.

If we don't provide a REALISTIC option for troubled youth there will ALWAYS be a large group that falls through the cracks.

Agreed. You can have all the prevention programs in the world available, but if the youth is not interested, he/she won't go or work in it's programs. California has more programs than most states.

Children in nicer areas/middle class and above make just as many or more mistakes as children in urban/crime ridden areas the only difference is the severity of the crime which is comparable to the difference in living between the two.

Not all kids in urban areas are involved in crime. Just because one is poor doesn't mean that one is a criminal and vice versa. Many middle class kids went down for violent crimes.

Exactly. Most people can't understand why anyone would commit a crime in America because they can't comprehend the way some people live.

This is true. Some people's lives are just plain "off the hook and crazy."

If you notice though they are always trying to come up with prevention programs and ideas about these little white kids shooting up schools. They not worried about just arresting the shooters, they also want to find a way to prevent other children from committing the same crimes. They just arrest us and do nothing to stifle the cycle.

Help is available for those that want it. Mentors are available for those that want one.

And like KevMac said, once you commit that first felony society makes it hard to get out of the cycle.

True. So the key word is......"Don't get a felony" This statement I just wrote is severely taken for granted. Life is easier without a felony, but it doesn't mean that's it's the end of the world. Many people with felonies were able to get their lives back together and move on. They had to readjust their lives and make different choices from then on.

When it comes to the minority and poor white youth in America no one want's to work on the problem to help the youth that have yet to be caught in the cycle, they would just rather say it's your choice.

Help is available and it is their choice. There are plenty of poor whites and minorities in communities all across America, that are not participating in violent or major crimes. They chose not too.

There comes a time in one's life when one know's the universal law of right and wrong. Even a small child understands this to a limited degree. Committing a crime, one knows there could be a chance of consequences. Committing a major crime or felony, one knows if caught, there could be jail time and felony lolipops handed out after the trial. These are givens, that's why people try to get away, these people are not stupid, they know what time it is.

The overall point I'm trying to make here is, at the end of the day, we are responsible for our actions. If I go out with a group of people and do a drive-by, and I'm the one who got caught and fingered, and the rest didn't, what can I say. "It's not my fault because I'm a victim of poverty."
I'm caught, there's nothing to say. Let's get it over with, and hopefully I'll make a more appropriate decision next time I'm free.

[StillNoScript]

Exactly. Most people can't understand why anyone would commit a crime in America because they can't comprehend the way some people live. There are thirld world elements to our society that is totally ignored. Thats why celebrities go overseas to adopt children like homelessness isnt a serious situation in our country for our youth.

This drives me insane. And, it's the reason why I don't take the White liberal media seriously, anymore. They act as if the biggest problem in America is Bush banning gay marriage and their privacy being violated. Bring up urban poverty, and they give you the same 'hand' to talk to as the typical conservative does. This is a disturbing disconnect that will damage progressive politics in Amerca for years to come.

If you notice though they are always trying to come up with prevention programs and ideas about these little white kids shooting up schools. They not worried about just arresting the shooters, they also want to find a way to prevent other children from committing the same crimes. They just arrest us and do nothing to stifle the cycle.

Well, if they did that in the ghettos, too, the prison industry would go broke. They have other ideas, as you are well aware.

[perongregory]

I used to believe in all this choice shit, but the truth is when greater power forces mobilize against regular people you cant expect all of those people to be superman and overcome that shit. Untill you read the history of this country and I'm not talking about no slavery shit, but the historyof the creation of the ghetto, the hypersegregation blacks experience everywhere in this country, the job market discrimination, schools, jobs, outsourcing, slumlords and etc. dont tell me no choice BS. God mad man not superman.

[rocstar]

common sense wrote:
Everything about life is a choice, and that's real.

Of course everyones route in life is determined by the choices you make, but if a child is in an environment where bad choices seem to be both the norm and the best option they are obviously going to fail at a much higher rate.

common sense wrote:
All the responsibility is not on the child. Parents/guardians/caregivers all share in responsibility. Unfortunately some of these responsible people are irresponsible for their own lives.

Exactly my point. If a child doesn't have a strong support system it is just another obstacle that can make them veer the wrong direction. If the parents are already lost it becomes about the child. Now what are we going to do to help the child become a valuable contribution to society.

common sense wrote:
Not all kids in urban areas are involved in crime. Just because one is poor doesn't mean that one is a criminal and vice versa. Many middle class kids went down for violent crimes.

Don't know if I wrote this wrong or you took it wrong. My point was as all kids make mistakes, most times the mistakes coincide with the environment that the child was raised. A well off child in a good neighborhood might make a mistake that gets them a slap on the hand. While someone in a violent NH might make one that gets them life.

common sense wrote:
Help is available for those that want it. Mentors are available for those that want one.

Remember we talking about kids. Personally, I don't hear too much about programs for the youth, they probably don't either. And then what do the children have to do to get in these programs. Catch the bus? Just sign up? Children are raised, we can't wait for them to raise themselves we have to go get them and provide help. They have to have a support system we can't expect them to do it themselves. If we do, we will continue to lose alot an have situations like the shit that happened in the Jungles.

[Common Sense]

^^^Good points rocstar.

[rocstar]

We both got good points, Im a hard liner when it comes to choice also but we still need to do more to help them make the right choices.

[StillNoScript]

We both got good points, Im a hard liner when it comes to choice also but we still need to do more to help them make the right choices.

Also, you can hold the rich accountable on their choice making, too. Look at the sentences they get for the same crimes that the poor commit? If the rich were punished the same way as the poor, we may not need any kind of social programs. They system probably would work itself out.

I'll never let go of the Oliver North argument because it still rings true. Someone will say that North, even though heavily involved with crack cocained distribution into L.A. in the '80s, did not 'put the pipe into anyone's mouth...they made the choice'. Yes, but North MADE THE CHOICE to conspire to sell dope, too. He was let off on a technicality, despite confessing. Either North should have been executed with Tookie, or they both should have been granted clemency and a second chance on life...as North was.

[dochesangel]

StillNoScript wrote

Also, you can hold the rich accountable on their choice making, too. Look at the sentences they get for the same crimes that the poor commit? If the rich were punished the same way as the poor, we may not need any kind of social programs. They system probably would work itself out.

Good point StillNoScript.....case in point..the disaster in New Orleans, and last I knew Bush was still president. Where's the justice in that????

Making good choices is a learned behavior. Add in the factor of having a good support system behind you so if you do stumble you have something to fall back on. I worked on a street team in South Central LA in the late 70's early 80"s. I was straight out of college, lilly white girl from the midwest....God, did I have my eyes opened. I quickly learned the meaning of true hopelessness. The kids I worked with didn't worry about bad choices, jail was as good if not better than where they were. Most of them didn't really know if they would see tomorrow and really didn't care. Since then I have been trying to do what I can to change that. I now travel across the states trying to help communities start programs for kids so that they do have hope and they do build a support system, and if the program does what it's suppose to, they do learn to make good choices.

[thegfromptown]

I am impressed with the dialogue. As you can tell, I am new to this site but I'm not new to the struggle of breaking cycles of stupidity. I have put myself in positions to influence youth as some of you have done. I'm not so quick to write their decisions off because of the "third world elements" in our society. In one form or another, all elements of our society effect all the others. I think it comes down to crappy communication between people who share more commonalities than differences but choose to focus on the differences instead and pure laziness. By the way, I think lazy people have brought our society down more than any single thing out there including racism, sexism, etc.
Why do people find the things they hate and then define a person based on that ONE thing? Is it easier that way?

[dochesangel]

Why do people find the things they hate and then define a person based on that ONE thing? Is it easier that way?

People do this because if everyone around you is a dumb f***up then hey that makes you the smartest one in town. The truth is there is something good in everyone you just need to find it and build on it. Unfortunately, our society is focused on doing exactly the opposite, but then truth be told our society or the powers that be really don't want to find solutions. They like the way it is. If it changed they might not be so powerful. Its like someone posted about how people are trying to find solutions to the school shootings. No they aren't. They just want us to think they are. They don't want to look at the real cause. They just want to cast blame. In Wisconsin they really came up with a winning idea........put a gun in every classroom for the teachers to use. Now that took some real genius.

Anyway, back to your question....I don't know if its easier but its what we've been trained to do. It really is true that if you continually tell a child they're stupid, they're no good, etc. they begin to believe it.

[shaun_zach]

I'm in agreement with what everyones says. We have to find ways to educate our youth and help them to understand that you have a choice in life for everything that you do. Society as a whole really don't want to deal with at-risk youth, they just sit back and wait for them to make a mistake and lock them up. Haven't you noticed that they are building more prsions than putting that money where it is really needed. I know the school system is fucked up, schools in lower economic areas have less money in their budget, produce the highest drop out and failure rate compared to the higher economic areas. No everyone that lives in the hood are not criminals but it is so hard for those kids that wnat to achieve because they have been labeled by society not based on want they know but where they come. Society states that if anyone in your family especially parents and siblings are drug addicts, drug dealers and criminal then that's what you will become. This makes it hard for kids to see pass this label. In their minds they think that well thay say I'm this and that even though I'm not I might as well be what they say I am.

[SouljahGirl]

StillNoScript wrote



I now travel across the states trying to help communities start programs for kids so that they do have hope and they do build a support system, and if the program does what it's suppose to, they do learn to make good choices.

Well where are you at.. I need to talk to you

[SouljahGirl]

Why do people find the things they hate and then define a person based on that ONE thing? Is it easier that way?

People do this because if everyone around you is a dumb f***up then hey that makes you the smartest one in town. The truth is there is something good in everyone you just need to find it and build on it. Unfortunately, our society is focused on doing exactly the opposite, but then truth be told our society or the powers that be really don't want to find solutions. They like the way it is. If it changed they might not be so powerful. Its like someone posted about how people are trying to find solutions to the school shootings. No they aren't. They just want us to think they are. They don't want to look at the real cause. They just want to cast blame. In Wisconsin they really came up with a winning idea........put a gun in every classroom for the teachers to use. Now that took some real genius.

Anyway, back to your question....I don't know if its easier but its what we've been trained to do. It really is true that if you continually tell a child they're stupid, they're no good, etc. they begin to believe it.

Please call me

[SouljahGirl]

I'm in agreement with what everyones says. We have to find ways to educate our youth and help them to understand that you have a choice in life for everything that you do. Society as a whole really don't want to deal with at-risk youth, they just sit back and wait for them to make a mistake and lock them up. Haven't you noticed that they are building more prsions than putting that money where it is really needed. I know the school system is #%@& up, schools in lower economic areas have less money in their budget, produce the highest drop out and failure rate compared to the higher economic areas. No everyone that lives in the hood are not criminals but it is so hard for those kids that wnat to achieve because they have been labeled by society not based on want they know but where they come. Society states that if anyone in your family especially parents and siblings are drug addicts, drug dealers and criminal then that's what you will become. This makes it hard for kids to see pass this label. In their minds they think that well thay say I'm this and that even though I'm not I might as well be what they say I am.

I beleive that there are more people out here that want to help our children then there are against them. It's just that the good people in society have no access into the Hoods.

There is a very small percentage of people who want to see our children fail.. But it just so happens that they hold most of the Power and Money at this time.

Change has come, those that were on the TOP will come to the bottom, those of us on the bottom, will be raised to the top.. A complete shift of Power is taking place in America.

When Yeshua ( Jesus ) walked this planet, he walked with us. The Thugs, the theives , the drunkards. He walked with us because even back then society had judged us and seperated us not just because of our deeds but also because of our poverty leval. Would we have been theives if we were not hungry, would we have stayed drunk all the time of were were not depressed about our conditions. All through out the Bible it speaks on the poor and the needy.

In this day and age, we have labled tribal warfare as Gang Banging. I keep trying to tell you all that nothing is new under the sun.. It is a different time, a different era, but the same issue.. We represent those with that Mustard Seed Faith. We represent the broken hearted and the down trodden. Those whom society has cast away.

Still................I Rise

[SouljahGirl]

Good Thread.. Let's resurrect it

[AllhoodPublications]

Good Thread.. Let's resurrect it

^

Most people can't understand why anyone would commit a crime in America because they can't comprehend the way some people live. There are thirld world elements to our society that is totally ignored. Thats why celebrities go overseas to adopt children like homelessness isnt a serious situation in our country for our youth.

Real spit.

Children in nicer areas/middle class and above make just as many or more mistakes as children in urban/crime ridden areas the only difference is the severity of the crime which is comparable to the difference in living between the two.

Thats real.. also in much worst areas there is least hope, less opportunities, and less resources. When you don't see any better, you don't know any better!

Making good choices is a learned behavior.

Exactly.

jail was as good if not better than where they were. Most of them didn't really know if they would see tomorrow and really didn't care.

That's real too, but at some point, some of us, really have to take responsibility for our own actions. Equally, some of us have to take advantage of certain situations. There are social programs, financial aid, trade schools, etc.. but as a sports fanatic it kills me to see the differences in baseball fields, basketball gyms, tennis courts, swimming pools, workshops and recreational areas. Sports and excercise is good for the mind, keeps kids active, determined, sociable, and most importantly it gives them something to dream about and pursue. Not every kid wants to be a lawyer, doctor, fireman or cop, but if he isn't given other choices then chances are higher that the kid will pursue the negative aspects of his surroundings. i.e pimpin, prostitution, drug sales, burglaries, robberies, grand theft, etc.

Alot of the older gang members from different gangs are not really bad people at heart, they were usually dealt bad cards, had least opportunities, didn't know any better, single parent household, seen their mother struggling just to put food on the table and pay a light bill/watter bill. So for the most part... the only true gang prevention starts with education and opportunity. Of course, home is always a good place to start but broken homes in poverty leaves us behind before we even start.

[SouljahGirl]

Good Thread.. Let's resurrect it

^

Most people can't understand why anyone would commit a crime in America because they can't comprehend the way some people live. There are thirld world elements to our society that is totally ignored. Thats why celebrities go overseas to adopt children like homelessness isnt a serious situation in our country for our youth.

Real spit.

Children in nicer areas/middle class and above make just as many or more mistakes as children in urban/crime ridden areas the only difference is the severity of the crime which is comparable to the difference in living between the two.

Thats real.. also in much worst areas there is least hope, less opportunities, and less resources. When you don't see any better, you don't know any better!

Making good choices is a learned behavior.

Exactly.

jail was as good if not better than where they were. Most of them didn't really know if they would see tomorrow and really didn't care.

That's real too, but at some point, some of us, really have to take responsibility for our own actions. Equally, some of us have to take advantage of certain situations. There are social programs, financial aid, trade schools, etc.. but as a sports fanatic it kills me to see the differences in baseball fields, basketball gyms, tennis courts, swimming pools, workshops and recreational areas. Sports and excercise is good for the mind, keeps kids active, determined, sociable, and most importantly it gives them something to dream about and pursue. Not every kid wants to be a lawyer, doctor, fireman or cop, but if he isn't given other choices then chances are higher that the kid will pursue the negative aspects of his surroundings. i.e pimpin, prostitution, drug sales, burglaries, robberies, grand theft, etc.

Alot of the older gang members from different gangs are not really bad people at heart, they were usually dealt bad cards, had least opportunities, didn't know any better, single parent household, seen their mother struggling just to put food on the table and pay a light bill/watter bill. So for the most part... the only true gang prevention starts with education and opportunity. Of course, home is always a good place to start but broken homes in poverty leaves us behind before we even start.

We need to RE-educate Parents in Poverty Stricken communities. Our minds aint right.

[SoulJah]

The Prevention, Intervention, Education and Awareness threads to me are the most important on the forum and its sad they are so under-utilised. Just look back at the knowledge, experience and wisdom that the older people have parted with, real talk on real issues. The internet can be accessed by everyone, would or could online support and advice for young people ever work in reality from a forum such as this?

Because someone needs to educate and inform young people so they can at least have the opportunity to understand the choices they are going to make in life.

I beleive that there are more people out here that want to help our children then there are against them. It's just that the good people in society have no access into the Hoods.

Lets go get them! Build some bridges and forget that the words isolation and segregation exist. Its a long battle but one worth fighting for and WE WILL get there