No More Mafia?

[mayugastank]

Off topic but extremely curious ..............................


does the LCN consider themselves white? The only reason I have been able to identify why Russian/Polish/Irish/German/Welsh/French gangs faded into history is because they all turned into the very forces looking to lock them up!

Italian Americans have a history of mafias and gangs like no other race or nation on earth farther and deeper then anyone and its why I believe that even after the 4th generation of their children have been borne into the USA they still remain extremely available to cultural ethos like the mafia. Hundreds of years old the mafia has remained almost like a throwback of what these kids parents were and I believe they hold onto their last cultural nuances anyway possible! LCN wil never die out but maybe in the USA it will sem almost pathetic to have children children childs holding onto Italys reputation......I wonder if that fate may well befell asian gangs/mexican gangs ( if they stop immigration!) ............but the Italians of the East Coast intrigue me ........I dont believe even Mexicans witha border a step away have been abel to hold onto their culture as dearly.

[mayugastank]

how many members could have a single street gangs? honestly, not more than 20 in my opinion...

Do you rember ever reading ....how the Italian immigrants to America were considered mustache petes greaseball dago wops who did construction and NOTHING ELSE? Laborers and mechanics and gangsters thats it thats all. Their gangs numbered in the 1000s'/..............................


THE ONLY REASON AMERICAN gangs exist is because of Italians ----Mexican gang in California are named respectively.............WHITE FENCE-started by russians. DAGO TOWN-started by Italians-DOGTOWN started by Irish-...........it was Italians who really migrated gangs anywhere they landed -WHY?
Because no other culture anywhere has anything similiar to what the Italians have anywhere else!......its the people history. To give credit where its due Italians really started it all . The lands rich history made sure of it. Facuilina...doesnt or I dont knwo what it is .........take into account that LATIN culture which originally derived from Italians is 1000s of years older then any other culture on this continent! could we compare Africas history -of longetivity to Italys? I mean come one of course Italians are going to be prime examples of what OC means .......they outlive and outlast everyone.

[mayugastank]

Bellomo has been out of prison for a while now. He was one of a few names thrown around as a possible successor to become boss of the family.


Either he lied to his daughter or he lied to LCN because they are incompatible! He told his daughter in front of the court that he was done with the life. That oarth must carry some extreme semblances because it seem some men will throw away the very lifeblood for it. While others break the oath those that accept and acknowledge it are far more numerous. I guess the oath means more then the Godfather or the Capo or the higher up because in the bonanos Amato refused to cooperate and took his punishement like a man even though Massino was telling on him............liek Ive said before the Italians must get there respect for really showing modern man how to actually behave like a man. Italians really beyond mafias and gangs have showed the world moral values that define what we know as masculinity and honor. More I read about the culture the more fascinated I become.

[mayugastank]

westside says"


Generally speaking, the mob still uses all of them though not quite as openly as they once did. They are more surveillance conscious now but will always be creatures of habit to some extent."


habit? well then why is it that thru all Americas white Americans only the Italians seem to be able to hold onto their habits? and only the Italians have lasted until teh 4th generation with STRONG familial and cultural ties? while all others have assimilaited completely ? could it be why WASPS (white anglo saxon protestants) held Italians at bay from recieving the white label for so long? This question really defines the future of LCN and the future of Italian Americans and should really have its own forum

[mayugastank]

look westside next time you decide ot name me a liar or biased or ethnocentric ............just read up on my post on the japenese and Italian people. 2 great and amazing cultures who really showed the wrold how to act. I actually really admire their histrories and when I speak what I say its with a heavy heart. I would hate to see the world without the history of the these people.

[Pauliewalnuts]

Let's say some street gang with huge numbers decide they wanna take on one of the families, or all. What would prevent them from succeeding? My main point is that it looks like most of the guys on the charts are old. Could they seriously put up a good fight? ( Sorry if this is a common answered question from your side)

no street gangs could even think about a similar thing... do you really think a bunch of 15-20 at most 18 years old punk could take one a crime family with let's say 2.000 between members and associates like the gambino's, for example? it's laughable, just laughable
street gangs are located in a few blocks, the mafia family are present all across the 5 districtsFaciulina
Light Heavy Weight


Obviously, 15-20 guys from a street gang taking on the mob wouldn't get far in the process. I'm from Norway, so I don't know much about street gangs in NY. But my question contained a slightly different scenario. Not saying it will happen, just asking what if. Anyway, Westside gave me the answer I was looking for.

[Faciulina]

Obviously, 15-20 guys from a street gang taking on the mob wouldn't get far in the process. I'm from Norway, so I don't know much about street gangs in NY. But my question contained a slightly different scenario. Not saying it will happen, just asking what if. Anyway, Westside gave me the answer I was looking for.

in the east coast street gangs barely exists so it's unthinkable... in other places this hypotetic scenario could be only in place where the mafia is smaller like los angeles that is full of street gangs, some of them enough large, but the mafia controls different thing than street gangs there so they needn't have any fight
in chicago the mafia is too strong and although there are street gangs they are nothing compared to lcn

Do you rember ever reading ....how the Italian immigrants to America were considered mustache petes greaseball dago wops who did construction and NOTHING ELSE? Laborers and mechanics and gangsters thats it thats all. Their gangs numbered in the 1000s'/..............................


THE ONLY REASON AMERICAN gangs exist is because of Italians ----

although there were italian gangs in the past most of italians were member of mafia, they have not any gangs culture but a mafia culture

[RDRIGN]

You seem to brush street gangs with the same paint, here in the United States we have very violent street gangs compared to Europe's street gangs that aren't on the same level as U.S street gangs. The people running those street gangs aren't 18 year olds but are grown men that use young adults to do the dirty work like the Italian-American mafias. Not all gangs are small some are pretty large like Chicago's GDs for example or MS13. Street gangs kill a lot of people in the U.S every year, compared to Europe where gangs aren't much of an issue like in the United States. I don't think the Mafia wants the heat the street gangs will bring to them if they somehow got in a war and in jail the Mafia has no chance unless they go into protected custody, it's just not worth it. Wasn't there a mini war going between the 67 Crips and the Rizzuto family months ago???

how many members could have a single street gangs? honestly, not more than 20 in my opinion... bloods crips ms-13 or latin kings have small groups in some blocks of a few city but they are not an unique organization they are disorganized and small... in new york and eastern coast there is not any significant street gangs nor in prison nor outside, in europe the street gangs are a total joke
the war in montreal is still a mystery nobody knows exactly what's going on there... it's sure an internal war anyway

Like I said you clearly have no idea of how violent U.S street gangs or anything about them, I can tell you aren't from the United States. Street gangs can go in up to 1,000s of members but of course 400 or so are "deep" and when I say deep I mean the guys that really greatly profit from the criminal activities, all of this of course depending on the gangs etc. Not all gangs are the same, some are way more violent than others. I've been locked up with Texas Syndicate members and MexicanEnemi members, real members not "coras" or "firme" and I can tell you that these guys do heavy stuff, from drug trafficking to murder for hire etc. no kids stuff. The MexicanEnemi members have to kill/killed somebody to be a real member and just because you have killed somebody you are automatically in the gang, you need to at least do time and put in heavy work, after months then you could be qualified to join the gang or not.

[mayugastank]

RDGRN----

good video.So the mexican mafia must number in the 1000s out there in texas. In california you could spend 10 years locked down and never meet a real verified member. I knew guys who did bits of 7-10 years and never meet a EMERO. In Los Angelos county jail at most you might have a few but rarely and usually their contact is extremely restricted. In total Boxer/Veneno and others who have flipped have said their are no more then 100 EME members in the state of California from outside to inside. They could never mount a war like in that video-they could have people killed by word of mouth no doubt-but for them to actually be warring never here! Usually here if they do something/murder a man or what not-its because he has informed and somehow is now abel to be killed. They killed a few in LA county jail through the years. Gang members in California number in the thousands and from Los Angelos to San Diego probably a 100,000 hispanic sureno gang members. All are itching and willing to be an EME but sadly most will never even meet a guy.

[Faciulina]

Like I said you clearly have no idea of how violent U.S street gangs or anything about them, I can tell you aren't from the United States. Street gangs can go in up to 1,000s

1.000 members a single street gang? LOL it''s BS, maybe the members of dozens different gangs combined
these people barely are able to control a couple dozens guys and a few blocks

[RDRIGN]

Like I said you clearly have no idea of how violent U.S street gangs or anything about them, I can tell you aren't from the United States. Street gangs can go in up to 1,000s

1.000 members a single street gang? LOL it''s BS, maybe the members of dozens different gangs combined
these people barely are able to control a couple dozens guys and a few blocks

Well the Texas Syndicates and MexicanEmie are criminal organizations not street gangs but they have hundreds of members and thousands of associates or "coras","firmes" etc. and street gangs under them, Tango Blast could be considered a street gang in the old fashion way but they are everywhere in Texas and in the thousands. Texas Syndicates use to order around and use the Tango Blasts to do their dirty work but now they have revolted against the Texas Syndicates and are currently at war. Everyone in Texas wants to be part of the Texas Syndicates or MexicanEmie and thousands are striving for it but only a few make it in. Blacks in the other hand don't really have criminal organization like Mexicans from what I've seen well not at least in Texas or California. Watch this.

[icegoodbarbPresident]

There really would be no point for streetgangs to fight the mafia because although the mob is involved in some drug trafficking. the gangs got the market cornered and if the gangs fought the mafia they don't need to be involved in gambling, loansharking labor and union corruption

[thewestside]

does the LCN consider themselves white?

Yes, Italians consider themselves white. Southern Italians tend to be of a slightly darker complexion than northern Italians but they look caucasian. Italian-Americans as well.

Either he lied to his daughter or he lied to LCN because they are incompatible! He told his daughter in front of the court that he was done with the life. That oarth must carry some extreme semblances because it seem some men will throw away the very lifeblood for it. While others break the oath those that accept and acknowledge it are far more numerous. I guess the oath means more then the Godfather or the Capo or the higher up because in the bonanos Amato refused to cooperate and took his punishement like a man even though Massino was telling on him............liek Ive said before the Italians must get there respect for really showing modern man how to actually behave like a man. Italians really beyond mafias and gangs have showed the world moral values that define what we know as masculinity and honor. More I read about the culture the more fascinated I become.

Obviously mafiosi are not completely honest with their own family members, particularly the women in their lives - the mothers, sisters, wives, and daughters. Bellomo certainly isn't going to tell the court he's going straight back to the life. He said what every mobster says when they want to get out of prison. His daughter actually did help his case though. Her tears for her father reportedly softened the judge up and he gave Bellomo a break. But I doubt Bellomo is really retired. At least in the ultimate sense. I'm sure he's got the money to do so but he's a stone cold gangster and will likely continued to be involved to one degree or another. Though likely not in such a high profile role as acting boss anymore.

[Pauliewalnuts]

Hey, Westside

1) Is it true that Bellomo became a made man when he was 20? If so, why do you think they inducted him in at that young age?

2) You got any recent info on Dominick Cirillo?

3) A lot of different info out there regarding when the mob opened the books for the last time. 1975, 76, 77. Do you have a reliable source? Do you know when and where John Gotti was made?

4) I couldn't find the picture of the gambino capos in 1990, but there's a guy there with glasses and looks like he's got a mohawk hair cut. Do you know who that is?

Thank you for your time, I appreciate it;)

[thewestside]

1) Is it true that Bellomo became a made man when he was 20? If so, why do you think they inducted him in at that young age?

Barney's father was a made guy in the Genovese family as well, if I remember right. He was close to Fat Tony Salerno and asked him to watch after his son after he died. Barney was made at a very young age and eventually took over Fat Tony's crew and even became acting boss for the family in early 1990's when Chin wanted to take an even lower profile after he was indicted in the windows case.

2) You got any recent info on Dominick Cirillo?

Obviously Cirillo is another name that has been thrown around as a possible successor as boss, along with Bellomo and the late Tino Fiumara. Cirillo was acting boss in the late 1990's before he had to step down briefly because of a heart attack. He later resumed that position until he was indicted in 2005. He's now out of prison but there isn't much info on him since then. Guys like Bellomo and Cirillo know the feds will be watching them very closely, especially when they are the ones people are expecting to take over. The Genovese family isn't that predictable. I imagine both are still in leadership positions but very much behind the scenes. They are going to do everything they can to stay off the fed's radar.

3) A lot of different info out there regarding when the mob opened the books for the last time. 1975, 76, 77. Do you have a reliable source? Do you know when and where John Gotti was made?

He was around that time frame in the 70's. There is a lot of conflicting info regarding exactly when, over the years, the books were opened and closed in New York. But it was at that time that Gotti was made, not long after he was released from prison. No idea where the ceremony took place but Niel Dellacroce officated at it.

4) I couldn't find the picture of the gambino capos in 1990, but there's a guy there with glasses and looks like he's got a mohawk hair cut. Do you know who that is?

I'm assuming you're talking about this famous chart. And you're probably referring to the guy third from left on the bottom row. He is the late Gambino captain Ralph "Ralphie Bones" Mosca.

[Pauliewalnuts]

Great answers, Westside!

1) Yeah, Mosca was the guy;) I googled his name but only a short article on wikipedia came up. Is he still alive? I haven't heard anything about him ever. Do you have any supplementary info on him?

2) What do you predict will be the outcome of Vincent Bascianos' trial? At least he seems to be on friendly terms with the judge, all that tie borrowing and such:)

3) When you say high profile mobsters are being watched very closely when released from jail, do you mean a 24/7 tail? Is there any way to cope in LCN with that kind of heat? Is it common that all administration members have that heavy surveillance on them?

4) Do you know the background for the foiled assassination atempt on Robert DeCicco in 2007?

Again, your answers are not taken for granted.

[thewestside]

1) Yeah, Mosca was the guy;) I googled his name but only a short article on wikipedia came up. Is he still alive? I haven't heard anything about him ever. Do you have any supplementary info on him?

Mosca is deceased. He ran a crew involved mainly in gambling out of Queens back in the day. I remember reading about an investigation into a card game they were running back in the early 90's. I think his son Peter took over the crew for a time after he died.

2) What do you predict will be the outcome of Vincent Bascianos' trial? At least he seems to be on friendly terms with the judge, all that tie borrowing and such:)

Life in prison.

3) When you say high profile mobsters are being watched very closely when released from jail, do you mean a 24/7 tail? Is there any way to cope in LCN with that kind of heat? Is it common that all administration members have that heavy surveillance on them?

What I mean is, if guys like Bellomo or Cirillo became highly visible in their roles as acting boss again shortly after leaving prison, that would immediately put them back at the top of the fed's priority list. Tino didn't seem to waste too much time getting back into the swing of things after he got out but Bellomo and Cirillo seem to be lying pretty low. Which is smart. That doesn't mean they are retired or no longer involved but they know enough not to become so visible right off the bat. The family is said to be run by several top leaders. And at times there will be one guy here or there that the feds identify as the acting boss. Many of them have come out of Barney's crew in recent years - Frank Serpico, Ernie Muscarella, Artie Nigro, etc. Danny Leo was from a different crew I believe but also based in Manhattan and the Bronx. Of course, Cirillo was originally from Chin's crew in lower Manhattan. The power has essentially been in those two factions of the family for years now.

Once somebody becomes an investigative priority, which certainly happens once they are pegged as a top leader in the organization, they have surveillance on them a lot. Not necessarily 24/7 but enough to cause problems. Of course, Genovese guys like Bellomo, Fiumara, and Cirillo were notorious for their efforts to avoid surveillance. Fiumara would travel to meetings curled up in the back seat of a car or even in the trunk. One time he also hopped out of a car while they were being tailed and road a bike across a park where the feds couldn't follow. Both Tino and Cirillo would have their drivers go down one-way streets and the wrong way up freeway off ramps to lose tails. One time Bellomo even walked right up to a surveillance van and looked inside spotting the agents.

4) Do you know the background for the foiled assassination atempt on Robert DeCicco in 2007?

That attempted hit took place shortly before Genovese soldier Rudy Izzi was found shot to death in his apartment. The close timing of both caused many to assume there was some sort of beef between the Gambinos and the Genovese but that was never confirmed. There were also rumors about Izzi being killed by the Genovese family because he was holding back money. But that was also never verified.

Again, your answers are not taken for granted.

As I think I've mentioned before, the best mob board to get answers like this is the Real Deal forum.
http://www.realdeal-forum.com/forum/index.php

In order to access the board fully you have to register. And in order to register the administrator (David) has to approve you. His email is below. Mention you're the "PaulieWalnuts" I told him about.
gangstersinc@hotmail.com

[mrinteresting]

mexican mafia is very dangerous!!

[mayugastank]

Mexican Mafia is dangerous and so is the black gangster disciples-latin kings-shoot even the little gang down my block has killed people in the past. The difference is that what you and the media label "mexican mafia" and mexican cartels are not synonomous. The EME is highly structured-disciplined and has official ways of recognizing members-they are also given street crews and occassionally orders to murder from their base in Pelican Bay-----in total their are about 100 members on the streets in prison and teh federal system has about 30+ of them.

I dont think you could compare the Mafia and the EME. At least not now. Many of these mafioso have serious history and serious major dollars. Not to long ago they were busted running a billion dollar sports book. EME has never reached that level of money as I know of. They also havent been around 120+ years with the same structure. They are killers and have ordered at least a 100 murders in Los Angelos in the last decade-and no other organization in America comes close to their ruthlessness and killings but they have a problem with their flat line structure and membership votes that allow all members to have a say in making new members-it doesnt allow them to expand and theyve closed their ranks for years at a time even when it was obvious they needed bodies.

[Pauliewalnuts]

OHH! Westside!

I sent an email to gangstersinc a couple of days ago. Still no answer but no rush;)

And here's some questions;)

1) About the Frederick Weiss hit, who actually committed it? I've read some articles which identify gambino capo Louis Vallario, others say Anthony Palermo and James Gallo killed him.

2) When you watch the sopranos, you see money like 50-60 grand and more being given away/ spent all the time. I realize the show is fiction, but do capos and higher ups usually always have that kind of cash? What is an avarage capo's earnings in a year? It may be a weird question, but hey I'm curious.

3) There's a guy with John Gotti Sr in many pictures taken during all of his trials. In one of them, he gives the guy a "punch" on the nose. Do you know who the guy is?

4) About the famous Gambino family administration picture you posted, there's a couple of more guys unfamiliar to me. Who are the guys left and right for Robert Bisaccia? Left for George Decicco? The three guys left for Louis Vallario? Don't overtrouble yourself with this question.

5) Some sources say the Decavalcante family operates mainly in Elizabeth. Others say they operate in many counties and cities. Got any clue?

Thank you very much:)

[thewestside]

I sent an email to gangstersinc a couple of days ago. Still no answer but no rush;)

The administrator (David) can be a little slow but he'll get to it. I'll remind him again.

1) About the Frederick Weiss hit, who actually committed it? I've read some articles which identify gambino capo Louis Vallario, others say Anthony Palermo and James Gallo killed him.

It was the guys in the DeCavalcante family. They basically did it for the Gambinos.

2) When you watch the sopranos, you see money like 50-60 grand and more being given away/ spent all the time. I realize the show is fiction, but do capos and higher ups usually always have that kind of cash? What is an avarage capo's earnings in a year? It may be a weird question, but hey I'm curious.

Mob guys are typically known as big spenders. It comes in and goes right out. It's hard to say what the "average captain" makes. Generally speaking, most mob guys are middle-class. Obviously the higher up the ladder, the bigger your earning potential.

3) There's a guy with John Gotti Sr in many pictures taken during all of his trials. In one of them, he gives the guy a "punch" on the nose. Do you know who the guy is?

The guy you're referring to is Anthony "Tony Lee" Guerrieri. He was in Gotti's crew and was a co-defendant in his union assault trial.

4) About the famous Gambino family administration picture you posted, there's a couple of more guys unfamiliar to me. Who are the guys left and right for Robert Bisaccia? Left for George Decicco? The three guys left for Louis Vallario? Don't overtrouble yourself with this question.

First Row: John "Johnny Boy" Gotti

Second Row: Salvatore "Sammy the Bull" Gravano, Frank "Frankie Loc" Locascio, Joseph "Joe Piney" Armone

Third Row: Giuseppe "Joe? Arcuri, Robert "Bobby" Bisaccia, Anthony "Tony C" Camaniti, Anthony "Sonny" Ciccone, Pasquale "Patsy" Conte, Joseph "Joe Butch" Corrao, John "Jackie Nose" D'Amico

Fourth Row: Frank "Franky Dap" D'Apolito, George "Georgie" DeCicco, James "Jimmy Brown" Failla, Giovanni "John" Gambino, Thomas "Tommy" Gambino, John "Handsome Jack" Giordano, John "Junior" Gotti

Fifth Row: Peter "Petey Boy" Gotti, Daniel "Danny" Marino, Ralph "Ralphie Bones" Mosca, Louis "Louie Bracciole" Ricco, Natale "Big Chris" Richichi, Mario Triana, Louis "Big Lou" Vallario

5) Some sources say the Decavalcante family operates mainly in Elizabeth. Others say they operate in many counties and cities. Got any clue?

Their main base is in Elizabeth. They do have some activity in surrounding counties in New Jersey though. Of course, they had some guys based in New York City as well some years ago but I don't know if that's the case anymore.